Are Crews Dead?

[Movement and Mathmatics]

It seems as if there are not too many Solid old school Crews anymore.
A lot of crews in today’s Graf game,
instead of like the old days when schooling kids and bringing them up was the building blocks.

There taking the fast food way and just recruiting and courting them for a summer making them down and using new writers to progress there intentions. As writers get older new talent is always a must if your intentions are bigger than your 3 best friends killing a city and being content.

Is this the progression and the direction of graffiti? Are we leaving loyalty and family for opportunity.

Sometimes 3-6 man crews can kill shit and stay true. But with commercialization, all these artist collectives of 50 plus artists, and taking top artist to just be down seem in my opinion watering down the meaning of crew.

Name your favorite active crews and crews you think are representing but just not representing.

And lets see some pictures of the Real and the Fakes.

[TubeSockTerror]

shut up homo face and die


/yourgaybitchnigguh

[Schnitzel]

um.........no

[DRUNKEN-ASSHOLE-ONER]

It seems as if there are not too many Solid old school Crews anymore.
A lot of crews in today’s Graf game,
instead of like the old days when schooling kids and bringing them up was the building blocks.

There taking the fast food way and just recruiting and courting them for a summer making them down and using new writers to progress there intentions. As writers get older new talent is always a must if your intentions are bigger than your 3 best friends killing a city and being content.

Is this the progression and the direction of graffiti? Are we leaving loyalty and family for opportunity.

Sometimes 3-6 man crews can kill shit and stay true. But with commercialization, all these artist collectives of 50 plus artists, and taking top artist to just be down seem in my opinion watering down the meaning of crew.

Name your favorite active crews and crews you think are representing but just not representing.

And lets see some pictures of the Real and the Fakes.



Let me guess.
You got the Mark Echo game a few months back and now you want to be a graffti writer.

[Movement and Mathmatics]

It’s pretty funny that kids on here would hate so quickly on a genuine topic. First of all I have been writing probably longer that most of you. I can almost guarantee it. But you never know who is who with screen names.

That was your mistake when responding to think I am some toy that just bought a game and learned Graff.

Maybe you don’t see the question as valid which is cool; it might be a bit over your head. a 3 word question might be too much for fake ass new jacks that thinking painting for 10 years or in most your cases the last 5 years as being an og.

Make a knowledgeable response next time, instead of just being ignorant.

[doreen]

For someone who has traveled all over the US and have friends in all sorts of different crews and what not....I back this thread hard.


I know what you mean, but I don't care/think it matters enough to explain.


evolution

[Movement and Mathmatics]

Yeah i think it is a hard topic to go into detail about, i was just wondering if it was only me thinking this.

[Abracadabra]

this is fucking retarded, and does not belong in brick slayers. moved. continue the clowning

[Saul Rosenberg]

It’s pretty funny that kids on here would hate so quickly on a genuine topic. First of all I have been writing probably longer that most of you. I can almost guarantee it. But you never know who is who with screen names.

That was your mistake when responding to think I am some toy that just bought a game and learned Graff.

Maybe you don’t see the question as valid which is cool; it might be a bit over your head. a 3 word question might be too much for fake ass new jacks that thinking painting for 10 years or in most your cases the last 5 years as being an og.

Make a knowledgeable response next time, instead of just being ignorant.

On this site it is nearly impossible to have a real discussion about graffiti. Most of the kids on here really don't know anything and cover it up with replies such as "shut up homo face and die". Personally I dont want to get into this topic but I do think it is valid and yes shit has definitely changed, for better or worse however, is open to opinion.

[earl broclo ESQ]

i kind of agree with abracadabra, this is fucking retarded. there are plenty of crews, still progressing, who have a legacy and hold to it. to ask if crews are dead? it's the exact opposite. all these young twits with barely any ball hair and a couple cans of paint, automatically have a crew. as soon as they find one other person, the call it a crew. they suck, take up space, and know nothing about respect and history. but they've got a crew. crews aren't dead, the leaders are still leading. if you really want to look at it, the idea of a crew is now being gentrified by kool aid smiles and mtv pipe dreams.

i've got a question to add:

if you've been following graff for a while, have you seen an over abundance of stupidity appearing after "getting up" dropped. i'm just curious if in your areas, you've had the same affect as i've seen in mine. our legal wall was ruined by it, lay ups were ruined by it. it just seems like everyone thinks picking up a fucking can and putting something on a wall makes you something worth bragging about. maybe i just didn't notice this before the game dropped? i mean the whole culture rape mentality has been going on for a while now.

[ANGELDUST]

WTF???? WE DROP CREW SPOTS ALL THE TIME...CREWS AINT DEAD - MAYBE YA HOMIES AINT PUTTING IN WORK.... EVERYONE I KNOW FEELS THE SAME ABOUT CREWS...PUSH IT AND REP IT...KEEP ON GROWING.

[Movement and Mathmatics]

Maybe are crews dead was a little vague, maybe i should say are real crews meaning crews with history and tradition still alive. Any young Newjack can start a crew and have no knowledge of its cities history.

Alot of this mentality also lies on the heads of the elite writers, who stay involved in there own egos and stand above everyone else.

It seems as the gap has widened so broadly than i can ever remember, between the haves and the haves nots. The elite and the complete idiots of graff.

To me there are era's of certain crews where they repreesented a true sense of the meaning, now with all the comingling of writers it seems like writers are repping like 3-4 crews depending upon who they paint with.

I Repped one crew for 15 years and Now dont rep not one, do to this fallen identity of a family.

Maybe its me but if i ever rep another crew it will only be one.

[earl broclo ESQ]

maybe that's just your thing. maybe friendships form with individuals in different crews, and that's how you get involved in a network. i guess i can see what you mean by loyalty, but at the same time --not all graff crews are run like a street gang. should they be?

[ILOTSMYBRAIN]

Nah crews aren't dead.

However I will agree with some of the other shit that you said.

I feel as if graffiti is where it is at for a lot of reasons, obviously the commercialization of it, spreading it's popularity to kids who would have never thought to get involved with the culture, in the first place.

However because of this, you see dozens of kids hopping on the bandwagon as we speak. Which causes a lot of mis-guided people to pick up cans and try to be down. That, with the hard bodied attitude everyone walks around with like they're fucking 50 cent or some shit not having to listen to nobody and do what you want, also contributes to all of this.

Finally what you had said about people being taken under their wing, and shown how it is done, properly at least in my eyes, doesn't happen enough, which also leads to people jumping in and out of the game faster then you're favorite southern rapper.

[ghostfaceguerilla]

bump

[ghostfaceguerilla]

this thread

[earl broclo ESQ]

ILOTSMYBRAIN --i'm with you on that. i think one of my biggest issues is with the attitude. i think people adopt that whole "thug" mentality, because of a pre-programmed notion. these forums are the best example of this. people just hate, to hate. it doesn't matter that they don't know the person, or that the person is 100% down, righteous, and supportive. but the fact that the person in mention, does 1 character that looks like a king 157 character --they are all of a sudden worthless, shitty, a biter, a faggot, a fucking chump, etc. people need to drop all the bullshit, and keep beef to an individual level. people can be the biggest bunch of bitches in this game, and unfortunately, internet forums are helping to hand that down to the next generation of highly influenced media junkies. i'll admit that's all a generalization. i think there is a serious divide between the good and bad aspects of the internet's involvement in graffiti.

[MainEvent]

i've got a question to add:

if you've been following graff for a while, have you seen an over abundance of stupidity appearing after "getting up" dropped. i'm just curious if in your areas, you've had the same affect as i've seen in mine. our legal wall was ruined by it, lay ups were ruined by it. it just seems like everyone thinks picking up a fucking can and putting something on a wall makes you something worth bragging about. maybe i just didn't notice this before the game dropped? i mean the whole culture rape mentality has been going on for a while now.
yeah same up here. the legal wall has all these tags from random ass kids on the signs and street surrounding it, so they think they're legitmate writers now. kids are tagging over pieces that have been around for probably over 10-15 years by respected writers who've died, and just generally disrespectful and ignorant things like starting the process of blowing up chill spots, leaving cans everywhere, etc. theres been a couple SFC tags around and shit like that where Getting Up obviously is spurring dudes into grabbing paint and scribbling ugly ass shit without a real appreciation or foundation of what they're doing in attempting to write graffiti.

[earl broclo ESQ]

our legal wall was ruined the same way. kids would just do one line tags, that sucked, over burners. pieces by respected locals. the wall was contained by a fence, and some jersey barriers. the owners of the wall were cool enough to let it be a legal wall, due to the fact that they can't use the property for anything else. i guess they buried some serious waste underneath, then paved over it, so now it's useless even as a parking lot. it was perfectly hidden, yet easily accessible to the public. i've only lived here for three years, but i guess when it first started, it was respected. it was just burners, and the occasional beef. out of towners came through, painted, and shit ran. since i've moved here (three years ago) i've seen it progressively get worse. people just throwing buckets of paint on serious pieces. kids just using the place to do fucking throws and one liners. people using it to take "cool" action photos of them doing lame shit, just so they can put "i'm a graffiti artist" on their myspace account. (i actually had someone show me this dumb broad's profile, to prove this point) then kids started hitting up everything outside the boundaries. shit got buffed, signs went up, but kids still couldn't learn respect. i understand the nature of the beast, but all of that shit should have been kept on the streets, away from the wall. so after a whole bunch of warnings, someone finally busted into one of the buildings and stole some shit. i doubt it was any graff kids, but that was the final straw. now you can't even walk on the property to shoot flicks, without the chance of police harrassment. there is a happy ending to all of this. the guys who run the building are still going to let kids paint, but it's going to be heavily regulated and by invite only. i'm personally cool with that, maybe that will bring back the flavor a legal wall should have.

[MainEvent]

yeah, the legal wall in portland is right on this bike path, so because of kids leaving all their empty cans all over the paths and general area plus all the disgusting tags all over signs, the overpass, and street near the wall, its inevitable that its going to be shut down. shit'd probably be for the better anyways because theres plenty of chill spots that are pretty much the equvilent of the legal wall in the respect that no one who isnt a writer with knowledge of the spot or the seldom random dog-walker would be at these spots, which would hopefully cut down on the number of toys.

[Cracked Ass]

Crews aren't dead.
Neither are disgruntled oldtimers who don't like how the game has changed.
I think your complaint isn't really about crews, it's more of a general distaste with hordes of newjacks. Sure, a lot of them aren't doing it like the old days. If your boys are, then you shrug it off. Your best policy is to 'act locally' and school newcomers you run into. If they have the right attitude and listen, you can bring them up and put them down. If they come with a wack attitude, then it's time for crossouts and beatdowns, which is also a form of schooling.
I get heated when I see new toys pop up and do stupid shit. But I try to remember that I'M the reason they got started. They saw me and my crew up in their town or on freights and they said "Cool! Ima do that!" And they bought a can of shit paint and scribbled somewhere and wondered why it didn't look like what they were copying. That was me ten years ago, as much as I'd like to erase some of those early years and attempts.

[earl broclo ESQ]

theres been a couple SFC tags around and shit like that

that game destroyed those letters. about a year before that game came out, i started painting with a friend of mine. neither of us are serious about it, and don't paint, but we do have a hidden wall that we can go to with a twelve pack and and some cans. so as a joke, we called ourselves the "Sexual Frankenstein Crew." it was really just a joke between us, based on how some crews start. then that game came out, and SFC was tainted. i was/still am pissed because i did some stickers with it on there, and i liked the name.

[peakSWSmob]

i've only been writing for about 6 months now, but im already throwing pieces
i've only been in 1 crew, which i am still in, we started it about 2 months ago and we've got almost 80 writers
but i like the idea of only having 3-6 good writers in a krew

but its all the same and it just comes down to getting up more, 80 writers can get up alot more then 6

[FSone]

i've only been writing for about 6 months now, but im already throwing pieces
i've only been in 1 crew, which i am still in, we started it about 2 months ago and we've got almost 80 writers
but i like the idea of only having 3-6 good writers in a krew

but its all the same and it just comes down to getting up more, 80 writers can get up alot more then 6

You're a toy.
80 writes? Joking right?
I disagree, you don't know much.

DIE.

Stupid thread.

[iloveboxcars]

i dont push crews unless every single person in the crew is a good friend of mine. large ass crews arent crews. they are networks. the only good thing about being in a big crew is when you travel you almost always have a spot to stay at.


and i disagree with the lot of you. this thread holds some merit.

[Bruce_1nR]

i've only been writing for about 6 months now, but im already throwing pieces
i've only been in 1 crew, which i am still in, we started it about 2 months ago and we've got almost 80 writers
but i like the idea of only having 3-6 good writers in a krew

but its all the same and it just comes down to getting up more, 80 writers can get up alot more then 6

AHAHAHAHAH THIS SHIT MADE MY FUCKING NIGHT! THANKS KID!

[Evangelion>Ogre]

The whole 'crews recruiting by whoever's hot this month' thing has become a serious
problem in a lot of cities..These kids are not being schooled properly, and it shows in
their shitty attitudes toward history, and their horrible letter structures. Kids have been
getting down with crews with over 15 years of history based off a couple of months of
work, then start beef with other crews, cause infinite headaches for people trying to do
right by the tradition of this whole thing, and ruining the credibility of a lot of quality crews.

More and more, I've come across old schoolers from other crews, and asked them
what's up with that new guy, only to hear "I don't even know that guy, I think
so-and-so put him down". It would almost be sad, if it weren't so annoying.

[WorldBench]

How about deleting this thread, it's stupid.

Who "RECRUITS FOR CREWS"

yea they send scouts out on the street and try to get the dopest writers.

[Evangelion>Ogre]

You'd be surprised. People are out there asking, "Who's this dude? He's been
wrecking the lines lately.." Then a few weeks later, said person is already repping
that crew, until they catch a case or two, then they quit, and start calling themselves legends.

There have been a lot of unwanted changes to the way things happen
in this thing, and if you think for one second that tradition isn't at all important,
it probably isn't affecting you personally.

[Movement and Mathmatics]

The whole 'crews recruiting by whoever's hot this month' thing has become a serious
problem in a lot of cities..These kids are not being schooled properly, and it shows in
their shitty attitudes toward history, and their horrible letter structures. Kids have been
getting down with crews with over 15 years of history based off a couple of months of
work, then start beef with other crews, cause infinite headaches for people trying to do
right by the tradition of this whole thing, and ruining the credibility of a lot of quality crews.

More and more, I've come across old schoolers from other crews, and asked them
what's up with that new guy, only to hear "I don't even know that guy, I think
so-and-so put him down". It would almost be sad, if it weren't so annoying.


This is exactly my point. When crews grow they are watered down, and sometimes most take the shortcuts. They take the hot Rookie who is killing shit or has a sick new style, try to get him before someone else does. He's a hot free agent cause he has some time on his hands, he gets courted by some of the heavy hitters in the city, kicks it gets put down then as fast as he came in this game falls off. If he doesnt fall off, he gets a big ego and just as fast as he got down with that crew, travels and then joins a bigger more known crew. and so on and so forth. Im not being totally negative towards crews and recruiting, its just the patterns that i see are knowhere near what i have seen in the past. Not all kids will end up like this either, i have seen succesful recruiting.

As an overall though, bigger crews are spreading over states and countries recruiting to make themselves feel dominant, or international or cross country. Whatever rep they want to claim. Shit to me it was kicking at a table sketching and drinking with 5-10 of my closest friends and forming something. Creating and pushing each other towards greatness. Shit has done changed.

[earl broclo ESQ]

it's evolution.

i can see what you're saying, and why you're worried about all of this. BUT, it's unfortunate that popularity through media and progression, has changed what you're rooted in. it's a double edged sword, even you can admit to success in what is bugging you. but would you say the greater percentage of crews today, are just fucked up in structure? if you're willing to bring up this arguement, i'm assuming you have a greater knowledge than your own local unions.

recruiting could work to keep things from going extinct, or it could just blow up the ego of another kid who didn't get hugged enough as a child. if crews were run by samurai code, you'd probably be a happier person.

[Movement and Mathmatics]

it's evolution.

i can see what you're saying, and why you're worried about all of this. BUT, it's unfortunate that popularity through media and progression, has changed what you're rooted in. it's a double edged sword, even you can admit to success in what is bugging you. but would you say the greater percentage of crews today, are just fucked up in structure? if you're willing to bring up this arguement, i'm assuming you have a greater knowledge than your own local unions.

recruiting could work to keep things from going extinct, or it could just blow up the ego of another kid who didn't get hugged enough as a child. if crews were run by samurai code, you'd probably be a happier person.


:biglaugh: I probably would. But I guess thats why i brought the topic up, it was those crews that i thought were impenetrable that i see doing this. Legendary Crews. I dont want to name names, but ive been disappointed lately.

[waseface]

the only crew thats dead is yo's foo!!!!

[Movement and Mathmatics]

the only crew thats dead is yo's foo!!!!

Nah my crew is still going strong, i just dropped it.....

[xrebelheartsx]

i dont push crews unless every single person in the crew is a good friend of mine. large ass crews arent crews. they are networks. the only good thing about being in a big crew is when you travel you almost always have a spot to stay at.


and i disagree with the lot of you. this thread holds some merit.

that's exactly how i feel about it. i'm all for crews getting bigger and all that, but if i don't know everyone in the crew, how can i rep that? how do i know that somewhere, in some other city, some dude that got put down is doing some stupid shit, and thus making the crew as a whole look bad? what if a train i paint rolls through that city, someone that has beef sees the crew next to whatever i've painted, and my shit gets dogged because this kid is being a douche nozzle?

one of the things that i think is awesome is when larger crews (not like these internet mega-crews) that are spread out across different states or cities or whatever get together once/a couple times a year for bbq's/hangouts/whatever. that, to me, is what a crew should be about. a group of folks that are all down with each other, and all have each other's back. i've dropped crews simply because i didn't get along with someone in the crew. and i'm not gonna get on some "i was here first" shit, because if i'm not the head of the crew, it's not really my place to say who is and isn't down.

but that comes back to everyone in the crew being tight knit. if someone's gonna get put down, it should be someone that everyone thinks should be put down. in political terms, it should be a democracy, and not a dictatorship.

and to sort of address the "recruitment" issue, as far as putting down the proverbial "new black", the kids that are hot right now, i think that's ridiculous. i mean, if you know the kid, and he/she is a down ass person, and not just some random that's out wrecking shit, it's a different story. but if i run into Writer X who has been out killing shit for the past month, i'm gonna say "yeah you've gotten up a lot, looks good" or some shit like that, rather than be like "yo you're up all over, push my crew". because i don't know this cat from tom, dick, or harry. he could start beef, he could be a snitch. shit, i've seen dudes brought down by people they were close with for years that ratted them out, so it's hard enough to trust someone as is, let alone some dude you hardly know.

honestly, if you're in a crew with a bunch of people that the only name you know for them is what they write, that's wack.

so for what it's worth, i fully back this thread.

[earl broclo ESQ]

^^well put rebel.

also --great use of "douche nozzle."

https://www.bethtyler.com/public_html/images/mscc_noz.jpg

[xrebelheartsx]

i think douche nozzle is a really under used term, and ought to be in the forefront of more people's vocabulary.

glad you appreciated it.

[Elidon]

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i107/Elidon/4chan/1144543356966.jpg

i totally agree with all of this, even the use of douche nozzle.

it'd be nice to see some crews that are actually crews, especially outside of tagging. if you don't trust someone enough to chill with them, why would you trust them with the fact that you're a writer?

[A Bolster pillow]

Amen to this thread
whats the point in being in a crew where you hardly know the people and are just in it for face value

[CurtisWarren]

Its sad to see once great crews turn into shitty one's. London's SB crew for example.

[!@#$%]

i always find it hilarious to read stuff like this:
First of all I have been writing probably longer that most of you. I can almost guarantee it.


followed by:
But you never know who is who with screen names.

[Movement and Mathmatics]

i always find it hilarious to read stuff like this:
First of all I have been writing probably longer that most of you. I can almost guarantee it.


followed by:
But you never know who is who with screen names.

?. Whats your point. I made that comment when some idiots made a quick judgment call to diss the thread instead of voicing there opinion or just leaving it alone.

With screen names i am not ignorant enough to think i have been around longer than anyone. But when someone makes a comment like the ones i was commenting about it shows there immaturity and i can almost gurantee they were some newjacks that didnt understand the question.

I think the thread has voiced its opinion, and i feel better im not the only one that thought this way.

Sorry if made you laugh.

[En Sabah Nur]

everybody just wants "one" in their name.

[gero]

^^ whats that got to do with crews?

[eternal_urge]

I dont know if its been said.. but

crew are alive and well...

its just that the new school kids havent been taught theyre history..

all these kids bite old school names.. old school crew names... all this type of shit..

ive seen some toys writing, NEW ABC CREW, BTC, CTB, all old school chicago crew... a kid tht writes sypher... its out of hand.. learn your history before you ever pick up a can.

[Elidon]

i always find it hilarious to read stuff like this:
First of all I have been writing probably longer that most of you. I can almost guarantee it.


followed by:
But you never know who is who with screen names.

I'm Seen and I approve this message.

[nightsblood]

to some extent, isn't this a natural outgrowth of the general trend of writers being older and traveling more and it being easier to get in touch with people through the internet etc? social climbing was always part of graffiti for some. now its a lot easier to do and it's gone nation/world wide.

it's also hard to keep the same crew for a long time when every one else you started with doesn't write anymore and you've moved to a different city 2-3 times since you started.

[iloveboxcars]

i always find it hilarious to read stuff like this:
First of all I have been writing probably longer that most of you. I can almost guarantee it.


followed by:
But you never know who is who with screen names.



why is that hilarious? majority of writers dont last upwards of 10 years.

[DATRUFFASIS]

AGREED
MOST WRITERS ETHIER DON'T DO A DAMN THING FOR A COUPLE YEARS
OR THEY PUT IN 4-5 YEARS OF HEAVY WORK AND THINK IT'S GOING TO LAST THEM FOREVER
I GOT NEWS FOR YOU
PAINT FADES
COME 2010
HALF THE WRITERS WHO STARTED IN 2000 WILL BE GONE

[downsouthjnkin]

acctually most writers i know of only last a maximum of three years and then they either break for a couple years or they quit altogether

[religion]

:scrambled::scrambled::scrambled:

[religion]

Q: Are crews dead?

A: No, its just harder to find a solid one, with the possibility of longevity.

[rokstar]

Yes. Unfortunate... but yes. I think loyalty has been completely cast aside... you have a ton of motherfuckers running around talking shit about kids in there own crew that are getting over more and more frequently or getting noticed more and more. I was raised up by an old head completely, who is very much still active so I have a touch of all the qualitys of the past and now... when I was comming up there were royalties to be paid in exchange all the knowledge your brain could hold. These dudes think if you got a tag a fill and a variation of a "piece" your some sort of serious graffiti rockstar. I mean writers that I've kicked it with that have been writing longer than I have, have no respect for anything and the more they become noticed the less they care about guideline to the game... I think graffiti is quickly decreasing and the nights ifind my self wanting to paint with a homie... I decide to hit the streets by my self. Its pretty sad...

[stop the lies]

actually our crews are running stronger than ever!

[podrido]

not that any of you care or even believe in what im bout to say but.
ive been writing since 93
i rep a crew thats been around since 91 and a oldschool crew from the late 80s
the crews im down with have been around since the early 90s and late 80s and still rep hard and are nation wide


over the past year i seem to have lost the "drive" to paint


shit happens

[ManBearPig]

Q: Are crews dead?

A: In Denver... Some kids put up there crew more than their own name.