wack stlyed kings

[*die*]

how should you react to kings who still look toy. i've been pondering this for a while, i mean there's GHOST, great fading tech. but ugly style. there's MONE from TFP i believe who has horrible looking letters. and the list goes on and on. i mean it's great that they're up but they look mad ugly.

[Abracadabra]

hmmmm, not the way i would have put your argument, but i agree that there are a few big names out there that haven't evolved of even fine-tuned their shit for 10+ years.

[GrImeY]

theres a couple well known writers where Im from and its not that their shit is whack but that it is fucking repetitive. I mean Ive seen 200 of one of these guys freights and its the same 4 simple letters no changes pretty much every time. He might throw something new in every once in a while , but people still jock him like hes got the illest style ever. Fuck it I guess hes gotten up alot.

[12345]

GHOST??? that kids font is known and copied in every city in this world that has graffiti. u need to step back, besides the fact that he pushed it harder than almost anyone in NYC history. Just because other people played out his style does not me it was wack.

[seeking]

die, you really have no clue man... as far as im concerned ghost is a hundred times fresher than cope and loomit put together...

[fiberoptical]

nevermind. Just tell them how wack you think they are next time you see them...see how far that gets you.

[miz303]

Originally posted by seeking innocence
die, you really have no clue man... as far as im concerned ghost is a hundred times fresher than cope and loomit put together... ...............um, i dont think so but i guess that my opinion is that cope 2 has had more style and influence then ghost but thats just what i see..........................a hundred times better no i dont think so

[DankLordz]

CAP. I respect him for what he's done bombing and all, but alot of his stuff is pretty intense.

[*die*]

check it i reconize that GHOST is mad up and put in some serious time into the game, but that doesnt mean that he doesn't have horrible style. CAP's king to but his throw is ugly. just cause someone's mad up and kind doesn't mean that his styles can't be ugly.to quote malcom X "when you can no longer recieve critisizim you can no longer change". for real i give em made props for how much he's put in the game all of em, but there shit looks ugly. for real if someone asked if their shit look wack i'll say yes. im mean there's so many kings being discussed with tight styles (reas ,saber ,espo ,twist just to name a few) so why can't ugly style ones be discused.

[jimmyjazz]

nevermind.

[seeking]

ghosts style might be ugly to you, but when i first started, ghost was one of my favorite writers. his letters were simple, but packed with such style, they were bursting at the seams. you might not see it, but that doesnt mean you get to judge for the rest of us. personaly, cope's pieces bore the fuck out of me. as do loomits, as a matter of fact, so do sabers, although i would hardly call him a king anyway. id rather look at ghost and five all day long.

another thing thats important here, is who receives the title of king. perhaps its just me, but as far as im concerned, it takes alot more than just 5 years of steady painting to be a 'king.' in my opinion, there isnt a single 'king' that has started in the last 15 years... kings were from a time before ours. which doesnt mean there arent some incredible writers to come out, but its a different world now a days.

[miz303]

Originally posted by seeking innocence
ghosts style might be ugly to you, but when i first started, ghost was one of my favorite writers. his letters were simple, but packed with such style, they were bursting at the seams. you might not see it, but that doesnt mean you get to judge for the rest of us. personaly, cope's pieces bore the fuck out of me. as do loomits, as a matter of fact, so do sabers, although i would hardly call him a king anyway. id rather look at ghost and five all day long.

another thing thats important here, is who receives the title of king. perhaps its just me, but as far as im concerned, it takes alot more than just 5 years of steady painting to be a 'king.' in my opinion, there isnt a single 'king' that has started in the last 15 years... kings were from a time before ours. which doesnt mean there arent some incredible writers to come out, but its a different world now a days. ...no disrespect but are you talking about how he fills in and who do you think is hot if cope bores you besides ghost?

[blood as ink]

ghost is rad..he does some weird stuff...but it's original.

but then again so is saber and i can't stand his style..i'll give him his "props" and whatnot but that's just my opinion.
people have different tastes that's all.

[mud_buddha]

Originally posted by *die*
... im mean there's so many kings being discussed with tight styles (reas ,saber ,espo ,twist just to name a few) so why can't ugly style ones be discused.

I don't know, call me crazy, but I think at least two of those guys would laugh at you for days for saying that they had "tight" styles and ghost doesn't.

[mud_buddha]

Actually, since you say REAS and ESPO have "tight" styles... I'm curious, how much of GHOST's stuff have you actually seen?

[blood as ink]

Originally posted by mud_buddha
Actually, since you say REAS and ESPO have "tight" styles... I'm curious, how much of GHOST's stuff have you actually seen?

very good point.

[Abracadabra]

Originally posted by mud_buddha
Actually, since you say REAS and ESPO have "tight" styles... I'm curious, how much of GHOST's stuff have you actually seen?


answer: not very much


and i've gotta say, if kid is mentioning espo and reas, obviously he's had a flick thru espo's book. now tell me those 2 ghost wholecars in there aren't super-fucking-fresh.

[455]

These guys have had their styles for so many years-and they have paid their dues a thousand times over-it's not their fault if kids "jock" them and jack elements from them.You must a least give them respect for what they have done--you say their shit looks ugly but to me..it looks fine.Tell me,what were you doing in 1980?...don't know about you-but I was about to go into kindergarten and liked playing with hot wheels.--I didn't even know what spray paint was....your arguement is going nowhere...

[seeking]

who do i think is hot if i dont like cope?

jessica alba is hot. milla jovovich is hot. lateita costa is hot. helena bonham carter is hot. monica belucci is hot. need i go on?

[socks]

style is somthing personal just because you dont like it it doesnt mean that hundreds of others people should have the same taste.
artistic impression.
view.
style.
taste.
form.
line quality.
shape.
colour....
there are hundreds of variables. make a list if you are bored but dont follow sombody elses guidelines.

[knife fight]

i know what people are sayin about ghosts style sometimes ill look at those letters and just hate em. i think what makes him dope besides being a hardcore ass bomber is the fact that his shit is so big, dynamic and in your face. his pieces are always so colorful and bold. it all comes down to personal taste and individual style. some people are in this game to paint the most intricate detailed pieces others are about huge sloppy shit. just cuz someone paints something outside the boundaries of what u would consider tight doesnt mean there shit sucks its just different. thats the thing about graffiti there are no rules u have to follow as long as u enjoy painting and get something out of it. thats what makes it so different than anything else on the earth(although that seems to be changing). putting boundaries on graffiti is putting a noose on graffiti. thats my opinion thanks for your time

[455]

the post above deserves a round of applause....AMEN.couldn't have said it better.

[*die*]

actually i've seen alot of ghost's shit but after awhile i wondered why i was diggin him so much. actually i've watching ESPO, and REAS for while i mean All Out Kings AOK are hella fucking tight to me there's more that ESPO and REAS there's MESH, WANE(especailly wane he kill shit wit finese), PURE and i know GHOST is wit em but still, i like his original throw upside down and flipped,but i'm not feeling the sperm looking GH that i've been seeing. aside from Ghost there's MONE from TFP i mean the crew's dope as fuck but MONE isn't to me.

[Abracadabra]

Originally posted by seeking innocence
milla jovovich is hot.


she has a pretty face an all, but i like my women to have boobs. this chick is more flat-chested than me

[miz303]

Originally posted by seeking innocence
who do i think is hot if i dont like cope?

jessica alba is hot. milla jovovich is hot. lateita costa is hot. helena bonham carter is hot. monica belucci is hot. need i go on? .........you forgot brook burke and carmen electra..........

[anonymous]

man im soo fucking pissed that i didnt buy the playboy issue that brook burke was featured in..at the time i didnt have any cash and i just figured i would pick it up later...now all i can do is turn on E! and dream...and is it true that in canada E! shows all the shit they blur out in the U.S.?

[anonymous]

i forgot about the whole "graffiti" topic...i gotta agree with seeking..cope's shit bores the fuck outa me too.

[seeking]

i'll agree man, milla has no breasts, but somethign about her completely allows me to overlook that fact. no, joke, i would make her feel like a woman, please believe it.

[mud_buddha]

Go with seeking on the whole mila issue. One of my friends worked on those calvin klein ads she did a few years back and I don't think he's stopped talking about her to this day.

That said, Monica Bellucci is the proverbial "shit." She's so sexy it hurts.

[seeking]

yeah man, monicas hot most definitly, but somethign about her just makes me think shes way out of my league... you know, as opposed to milla who would be stoked to date a 26 year old unemployed bankrupt graffiti writer... :o

[mosluggo]

I got sick of that playboy real quick. There's no good beav shots and she needs to trim her bush a lil bit more.

[wisp1]

Originally posted by seeking innocence
id rather look at ghost and five all day long

good looking out seeking. I know a lot of people hate five's shit but the boy IS an innovator, constantly changing. I don't think I've ever seen two five things that look exactly alike (including tags and bombs)

[Graff Jesus]

Originally posted by seeking innocence
yeah man, monicas hot most definitly, but somethign about her just makes me think shes way out of my league... you know, as opposed to milla who would be stoked to date a 26 year old unemployed bankrupt graffiti writer... :o

damn seeking you're a fucking old man!

[*die*]

Originally posted by Graff Jesus


damn seeking you're a fucking old man!

true dat. what up old timer (j/k) :lol:

[bigguy]

most of thes so called wak styled kings helped and or created the unique styles of today. r-e-s-p-e-c-t.

[mud_buddha]

Originally posted by Graff Jesus


damn seeking you're a fucking old man!

shit, if 26 is old I don't even want to think about what I am...

[imported_joewelcome]

boy am i glad that this thread has strayed from trying to pinpoint big names and then publicly trashing their style. there isn't much more futile and meaningless that you can get than wanking and whining over whose style you don't like on the fucking internet. think about it. and realize that if you were within 50 miles of ghost or mone it'd be a hell of a lot different when you decide to open your mouth. what do you think would happen?
a) you'd get off easy, they'd make you look foolish cause you're talking about someone and they never heard of you -OR-
B) you'd find out how much real writers like people openly criticizing them (and get a lesson on 'how it was like back in the days when you wandered into someone else's yard')

mone has paid crazy dues by the way, most guys here have just heard of him.

[dukeofyork]

Originally posted by *die*
how should you react to kings who still look toy. i've been pondering this for a while, i mean there's GHOST, great fading tech. but ugly style. there's MONE from TFP i believe who has horrible looking letters. and the list goes on and on. i mean it's great that they're up but they look mad ugly.


simply put: youre dumb.

mone's letters rip you a new one kid.

[boogie hands]

it upsets me when im going up my nose for a booger and i end up pushing it in that little area where your finger doesnt fit so then i have to go get a rolled up peice of toilet paper and try to snag it with the booger hunter before it goes up into my brain....it sucks too because if you fuck up with the booger hunter that its....game over....you got a booger up near your brain and you cant do shit

[*SIZEROKS*]

THIS POST IS STUPID.....

[ASER1NE]

OKAY SO WHAT IS THE DEFINITION OF A KING ?
I SAY ITS A WRITER THATS DOPE AS FUDGE , UP EVERYWHERE -FR8 WALL ROOFS...., COMMITED , CLEAN , RESPECTED.....

[soop01]

Originally posted by ASER1NE
OKAY SO WHAT IS THE DEFINITION OF A KING ?
I SAY ITS A WRITER THATS DOPE AS FUDGE , UP EVERYWHERE -FR8 WALL ROOFS...., COMMITED , CLEAN , RESPECTED.....

WORD!

[microsoft_golf]

Originally posted by boogie hands
it upsets me when im going up my nose for a booger and i end up pushing it in that little area where your finger doesnt fit so then i have to go get a rolled up peice of toilet paper and try to snag it with the booger hunter before it goes up into my brain....it sucks too because if you fuck up with the booger hunter that its....game over....you got a booger up near your brain and you cant do shit


hahahahhahahaaha...funny

[seeking]

it should really tell you something that the only people who start topics like this are very inexperienced writers, insecure about their own place in graff... i dont know anyone that actually sits around talking about what a 'king' is.

[DBMstyles]

cope dont bore me...true king

[rewire]

Originally posted by seeking innocence
it should really tell you something that the only people who start topics like this are very inexperienced writers, insecure about their own place in graff...

What's the running opinion on those who sit around fantasizing about women they will probably never touch or see, then typing their names like tragic incantations on internet message boards full of other men?

And those who like women with small breasts? Are they considered closet homosexuals or just closet pedophiles nowadays?

[Abracadabra]

oooooh. low blows

[ASER1NE]

i hope you werent reffering to me , bc if so i would have to inform you that i was just saying bc me and this guy were disagreeing about what exactly boosts you from just dope----->king........

[JoeHatesCops]

Ghost not a king? i know his GH throws appear simple, but that guy has lotsa of tight stuff, a tight style, and obviously hes up. but my opinion is based on flicks Ive seen, so Im not exactly an authority on the matter.
But by judjing othe rpeoples opinions, my guess is I am correct with my assumption haha

[*die*]

Originally posted by rewire


What's the running opinion on those who sit around fantasizing about women they will probably never touch or see, then typing their names like tragic incantations on internet message boards full of other men?

And those who like women with small breasts? Are they considered closet homosexuals or just closet pedophiles nowadays?

this kid came out with a tko punch

[mud_buddha]

Originally posted by rewire


What's the running opinion on those who sit around fantasizing about women they will probably never touch or see, then typing their names like tragic incantations on internet message boards full of other men?


lol. very deep. blazing insight. great pop psychlogy. you must be very popular at your local starbucks.

The running opinion? That they're acting like practically every other male? Is this supposed to be an insult? I mean, men fantasizing about women that they'll never touch is one of the great male pasttimes.

[seeking]

i'll agree, dudes reply was much better than most of the pre-pubescent nonsense you kids refer to as a comback, but lets be frank, milla's beauty alone creates an impenetrable shield around me, that no mans insults can break through. if wanting to sleep with her makes me a pedaphile, well then.....come here little girl, i got some candy for you...

[mosluggo]

Obviously. it depends on what city or medium your talking about. But from where I've been, here's my opinion: Anok Jor Rolex Revok Sever Cycle Temper PE Sivel Lone Awol Peas Mber EWOK

[Nic Thamaire]

You(ll be surprised!

Couzin Frank did dem all,, backward,upsidedown,top to bottom
always w/ that soft throwie style that burn your retina !!

[23578]

ghost? are you fucking kidding me? nah, i will throw a few names out and it's not to say i'm onto something better or whatnot. anyway, let's run it down;
smith-sane i dug that kid, smith i like the throw sometimes
expert-i just don't get that kid's style, where are the letters?
oops, i'm late, more later?

[Cracked Ass]

Both of the thread topics are dumb. Sit on the internet and badmouth people who put in mad work, and stick up for small tits? You're all several wasted minutes closer to dying.
My only input is this: what the fuck is wrong with repetition? So what if somebody does the same piece over and over? 200 ups is 200 ups. I can't be a king if I don't change my style every time I go out? More dumbass ideas for a weak thread.

[imported_YEAHMANWORD]

Originally posted by seeking innocence
ghosts style might be ugly to you, but when i first started, ghost was one of my favorite writers. his letters were simple, but packed with such style, they were bursting at the seams. you might not see it, but that doesnt mean you get to judge for the rest of us. personaly, cope's pieces bore the fuck out of me. as do loomits, as a matter of fact, so do sabers,

copes pieces do involve the same style most of the time but he is skilled. his designs, work, coloring skills, ups...his is an all around king. loomits pieces are always fun to look at due to his skill at shading, concept and design. saber however does bore me but hes hit some interesting spots.


i will agree though in saying that i would rather look at ghost pieces anyday of the week. exploding with flavor and overall rawness

[23578]

Originally posted by Cracked Ass
Both of the thread topics are dumb. Sit on the internet and badmouth people who put in mad work, and stick up for small tits? You're all several wasted minutes closer to dying.
My only input is this: what the fuck is wrong with repetition? So what if somebody does the same piece over and over? 200 ups is 200 ups. I can't be a king if I don't change my style every time I go out? More dumbass ideas for a weak thread.
seeing as you posted after my post, i will take this comment personally. i like smith's throw, it's his peices that i don't dig so much. expert's piece throw thing i don't feel somuch even though it's done expertly, everything else i like by him. there isn't much graffiti i don't like. i respect everyone going out and giving up there time even if they're putting up the same shit over and over. there are only so many ways to get noticed quickly, hello people, fr8's move, big letters or repetitive wild style is the key let's not forget.

[Graff Jesus]

Originally posted by Cracked Ass
Both of the thread topics are dumb. Sit on the internet and badmouth people who put in mad work, and stick up for small tits? You're all several wasted minutes closer to dying.
My only input is this: what the fuck is wrong with repetition? So what if somebody does the same piece over and over? 200 ups is 200 ups. I can't be a king if I don't change my style every time I go out? More dumbass ideas for a weak thread.

in my opinion, if you do the same piece 200 times, you're just as weak as the kid who did 1 piece with that same style.

numbers don't make you a king. sorry. maybe king of the streets where numbers and spots are key, but if it's something like 200 freights or walls... nuh uh. that shit don't ride with me.

[AREANKAY]

generly the way i see it is unless you live in that city you dont know who the real kings are casue you see all this shit form some people all over the internet so you thikn yeh they must be like the ones that are up the most then you get to that city and you hardly see any of that persons stuff but you notice that there is a ton of other people stuff that you never seen before and there on like evry pole in town and usually there teh guys that you prolly think have the toy style but hey when you get up s like the real bombers and kings got try doing your pretty down to a T style and see how far it gets you

[Spoter]

Originally posted by Graff Jesus


in my opinion, if you do the same piece 200 times, you're just as weak as the kid who did 1 piece with that same style.

numbers don't make you a king. sorry. maybe king of the streets where numbers and spots are key, but if it's something like 200 freights or walls... nuh uh. that shit don't ride with me.
i agree with cracked on alotta subjects, but i definately side with graff jesus on this one.anyone could do one thing 1000 times.that doesn't mean shit to me.you gotta push yourself to evolve.there are exceptions:throwups /tags bombing.these elements were practically made to be done quick and repeatedly to leave a trail of signatures saying simply"i was here".pieces are the art part of graffiti.if you can't switch up your pieces then maybe you aren't an all around.

[Smart]

Originally posted by >>>spot<<<
Ianyone could do one thing 1000 times

how many have YOU done?

[Spoter]

i put in work don't worry about it.i'm not gonna prove myself to some kid on the net.i might spend some time on this site, but i actually PAINT.kids like you think you know something.i guess the internet is where you belong.

[Smart]

heh, yeah, ok...

[*die*]

it funny when your downing and realized what you've done after

[seeking]

mber and onorok do basicaly the same pieces everytime they paint, and people shit themselfs everytime they see one of their trains.

what cracked was saying, i believe, is that trains are about exposure. you dont paint a train so you can get a flic of it then send it to a magazine. you do it to put that train, and your name, out into circulation. with the millions of trains out there, it would be impossible to come up with different styles for each one, especially if your painting several trains a week. i would rather see a consistent style that was dope, than a bunch of half assed styles from a writer just in the name variety.

[mud_buddha]

Originally posted by seeking innocence
mber and onorok do basicaly the same pieces everytime they paint, and people shit themselfs everytime they see one of their trains.

what cracked was saying, i believe, is that trains are about exposure. you dont paint a train so you can get a flic of it then send it to a magazine. you do it to put that train, and your name, out into circulation. with the millions of trains out there, it would be impossible to come up with different styles for each one, especially if your painting several trains a week. i would rather see a consistent style that was dope, than a bunch of half assed styles from a writer just in the name variety.

There's a difference between a little variety and distinct styles, although I do think distinct styles is definitely an approachable goals if that's what you're aiming for. If you've got letters down, you have the interest and are willing to experiment (which means you are willing to fail), you can easily do many styles. That's reality. These days, most people aren't willing to fail, so they get into a comfort zone and start repeating themselves (with very little variety.) To me that's boring. If I was interested in starting a "how can you not like that guy" thread I could put together a long list of "known" writers that bore the fuck out of me with their serial repetitiveness. Some of the most jocked "superstars" on this board put me to sleep with their shampoo instruction careers.

Look at some of the train era kings from NYC. Those guys did a lot of pieces and I can't think of many people that did the same shit every time. BLADE did fifty million cars and there's so much variety there it's not even funny. SEEN did a billion diff. styles, too. Blockbusters, bar letters, pure wild styles, etc. (the fact that he does the basically the same piece every time nowadays disturbs me) DONDI made it impossible to do the same piece over and over again by painting five hundred different names. Even if he worked in the same style, each piece was distinct enough to be unique. Many people don't even provide that uniqueness, they just provide a carbon copy of what's come before with like two doo-dads switched around. Boring as fuck. There are plenty of other examples of people who switch it up successfully with volume. For modern guys, BATES & CYCLE are two that spring immediately to mind, although there are dozens of other examples.

[sodapop7]

Originally posted by seeking innocence
it should really tell you something that the only people who start topics like this are very inexperienced writers, insecure about their own place in graff... i dont know anyone that actually sits around talking about what a 'king' is. agreed.....

[Graff Jesus]

Originally posted by mud_buddha


There's a difference between a little variety and distinct styles, although I do think distinct styles is definitely an approachable goals if that's what you're aiming for. If you've got letters down, you have the interest and are willing to experiment (which means you are willing to fail), you can easily do many styles. That's reality. These days, most people aren't willing to fail, so they get into a comfort zone and start repeating themselves (with very little variety.) To me that's boring. If I was interested in starting a "how can you not like that guy" thread I could put together a long list of "known" writers that bore the fuck out of me with their serial repetitiveness. Some of the most jocked "superstars" on this board put me to sleep with their shampoo instruction careers.

Look at some of the train era kings from NYC. Those guys did a lot of pieces and I can't think of many people that did the same shit every time. BLADE did fifty million cars and there's so much variety there it's not even funny. SEEN did a billion diff. styles, too. Blockbusters, bar letters, pure wild styles, etc. (the fact that he does the basically the same piece every time nowadays disturbs me) DONDI made it impossible to do the same piece over and over again by painting five hundred different names. Even if he worked in the same style, each piece was distinct enough to be unique. Many people don't even provide that uniqueness, they just provide a carbon copy of what's come before with like two doo-dads switched around. Boring as fuck. There are plenty of other examples of people who switch it up successfully with volume. For modern guys, BATES & CYCLE are two that spring immediately to mind, although there are dozens of other examples.

i could have not said it better myself. thanks.

[fiberoptical]

the net has no relation as to what really goes on in these streets.and or do the mags really represent the whole of a certain city...
Half of the kids who have certain names in their mouths ain't seeing these streets, and ain't walking these fuckers either.The real kings know
what the fuck is going on and give dap where it is due....the rest of yall should just shut up, not worry about it and paint..then you will have kings giving you respect ...reading half of this shit makes me cringe...what the fuck you talking about.,.ghost, mber,rolex,cycle,cope,saber..sure I am not a fan of all their shit, but these fuckers paint...and they don't seem to stop....and to me...that is a king..someone who just keeps going and going.....doing their thing.I would rather see any of them up in the streets, than all of your internet names arguing over wacked styled kings...and as far as I see it...wack styled or not..a king is a king.....niggas know...niggas know..


:mad:

[23578]

Originally posted by mud_buddha


There's a difference between a little variety and distinct styles, although I do think distinct styles is definitely an approachable goals if that's what you're aiming for. If you've got letters down, you have the interest and are willing to experiment (which means you are willing to fail), you can easily do many styles. That's reality. These days, most people aren't willing to fail, so they get into a comfort zone and start repeating themselves (with very little variety.) To me that's boring. If I was interested in starting a "how can you not like that guy" thread I could put together a long list of "known" writers that bore the fuck out of me with their serial repetitiveness. Some of the most jocked "superstars" on this board put me to sleep with their shampoo instruction careers.

Look at some of the train era kings from NYC. Those guys did a lot of pieces and I can't think of many people that did the same shit every time. BLADE did fifty million cars and there's so much variety there it's not even funny. SEEN did a billion diff. styles, too. Blockbusters, bar letters, pure wild styles, etc. (the fact that he does the basically the same piece every time nowadays disturbs me) DONDI made it impossible to do the same piece over and over again by painting five hundred different names. Even if he worked in the same style, each piece was distinct enough to be unique. Many people don't even provide that uniqueness, they just provide a carbon copy of what's come before with like two doo-dads switched around. Boring as fuck. There are plenty of other examples of people who switch it up successfully with volume. For modern guys, BATES & CYCLE are two that spring immediately to mind, although there are dozens of other examples.

what this guy said, and graff jesus too. it's funny i automatically started this vein of talking about freights because that's common between all the us cities. what graff jesus said definately holds true, however, as far as street stuff. on that note, i'm a big fan of those people who stick with certain shit, it's boring after a few years, but whatever, it's there. it's all right to have your six or three grades so you can bust out A grade shit in the cuttier spots, and C grade shit on main street. rambling.

[seeking]

mud buddha, while i agree with you for the most part, i think there are a couple of things that need to be taken into account.

1. back in 'the day' alot of the stuff that was incredible then, would be pretty mediocre if done today. which isnt to say that it wasnt fresh, but with advancements in styles, quality and what not, there is a new level that must be achieved to be considered good. now a days people expect alot more from other writers. or atleast people that arent dick riding ass kissers expect more. because of this, there is alot less lee-way to fail. your letters have to be alot better these days. one bar that isnt perportional and it throws the whole piece off. for instance, keo posted some old trains recently, one was by cliff i think. now, personaly, dudes letters were not good. his 'ff' was all smashed together and totally didnt fit. but it was still fresh. why? cause it was then. cause it was on a ny subway. cause the standards werent the same. but, if someone posted that same piece today, done on a freight, they would get laughed at.
what is the whole point? the point is that you could get away with having letters that were a little more 'lacking'. each piece was dope simply because it was accomplished, not just because of the letters.

2. this is purely speculation on my part, but i have a hard time believing that dondi, seen or any of the old time guys were painting 400, 500 trains a year. i could be totally off, but it just doesnt at all seem logisticly possible. there simply werent that many cars to paint on. that right there, automaticly makes it more of a reason to come up with different styles, because you're not going for a 'quality, quantity.' like you do on freights. its a completely different ball game. back then, if you painted one car, it got seen by tens of thousands of people in one day. with freights, you can go weeks before anyone really sees it, much less anyone that even cares that its there.

so whats my point? well firstly, ive never painted the same outline twice in my life, but im also not putting up those numbers, but regardless. i have no problem with someone who does the same thing ten, twenty, even fifty times, when they are putting in that much work. jase for instance. ive seen alot of his stuff that looked similar, but its still fresh because each one is solid.

i dont know. who cares what i think, and im sure i could have said it in much fewer words, but whatever.

dinner time.

dont anyone mistake what im saying, im not dissing any of the old guys, just saying

[montanaman]

this is wat i mean about niggahs disrespecting old skool ... im tired of idiots trying to tell us how to,, or why didnt we do this,, or that wasnt looking right ... hey die im sure in some shape or form u have done bubble styles in ur throwies.. and some time u try putting arrows in ur shiyt too. now who the hell u think brought this whole puzzle together ... these cats got ideas back in the late 70 and in the mid 80s... where all that matter was slap ur shit up and hope it runs for a while or did it make it out the yard or is it on the way to the buff line.... theres a lot here your not thinking about and beside they pioneer the way for many im sure u must have bit a chunk off of it and flipped it ....like u said when these cats where out there rackin paint u was in preskool eating crayola crayon ... u shouldve kept ur opinions to your self and not had started this thread......

[Cracked Ass]

It sounds to me like a lot of people have forgotten the original point of graffiti. Get up. A lot.
I'm not impressed by these style chameleons with no recognizable persona. If being able to rock six hundred styles is your thing, great - do whatever brings you enjoyment. There are some kings who did a lot of styles well, and you knew who it was right away, and I give them props. But the idea of clowning kings like Cope or Mber for not varying their style enough for YOUR tastes is equal parts wackness, ignorance and stupidity.

[Spoter]

all graffiti writers paint for fame to a certain degree, but i think in a lotta cases fr8 writers are the biggest fame whores.i mean to stratigically paint the same piece so many times has definately that purpose for fame.of course that's heart, but the pure fun of painting gets lost in that sometimes.shit, maybe it's just me, but i get bored quick with one piece.i love the constant challenge to experiment with new styles.it gives a diferent experiment, flavor, memory to that night it was painted.i'm not saying do a complete different piece every time, but man...some people just bore me to hell.i just can't imagine anyone going out night after night for years painting the same piece and look back and feel accomplished.i mean fame is a major part of graff and i'm not knocking that, but you started because it was fun.but if fame is your goal, you'll eventually get the recognition painting the same piece 1000 times, cause people will catch it regardless.but that's definately notwhat i'm about.

[Graff Jesus]

Originally posted by >>>spot<<<
all graffiti writers paint for fame to a certain degree, but i think in a lotta cases fr8 writers are the biggest fame whores.i mean to stratigically paint the same piece so many times has definately that purpose for fame.of course that's heart, but the pure fun of painting gets lost in that sometimes.shit, maybe it's just me, but i get bored quick with one piece.i love the constant challenge to experiment with new styles.it gives a diferent experiment, flavor, memory to that night it was painted.i'm not saying do a complete different piece every time, but man...some people just bore me to hell.i just can't imagine anyone going out night after night for years painting the same piece and look back and feel accomplished.i mean fame is a major part of graff and i'm not knocking that, but you started because it was fun.but if fame is your goal, you'll eventually get the recognition painting the same piece 1000 times, cause people will catch it regardless.but that's definately notwhat i'm about.

feel me? i know dudes like we're talking about. shit i used to paint with em. this one guy who'll go unnamed has been doing the SAME DAMN PIECE for about 5 years now. he just switches little "connectors and splits" and he thinks it's dope. that shit isn't fresh!!!

i don't know about the rest of you but i'm not a fucking machine. my graffiti isn't meant to be mass produced - i try and make it a one of a kind type deal. hopefully if someone catches a good amount of my stuff they will remember it, flick it, etc. i like catching good pieces and being able to look back and say "damn i caught some ill shit today". i get pissed off when i see the same guy's style over and over again. yeah dude may be up, but when you see his pieces do you flick em? what's the purpose if you've got albums of photos, but they're all carbon copies? what's the purpose if someone sees your shit on the regular but can't tell if it's the same train just coming back again and again? (yeah i know that's taking it a bit far)

what makes things worse is that there are legions of toys coming up now who look up to these so called "kings". it just makes the whole cycle repeat. these kids wanna emulate what they see, then they never try to get better. they just do the same crap over and over. fuck that!

i feel 100% what you said spot - hopefully this banter will cause some people to wise up and see things our way. :(

[Smart]

Originally posted by Graff Jesus
i feel 100% what you said spot - hopefully this banter will cause some people to wise up and see things our way. :(

yeah, I'm gonna defect over to your side now, EVERYONE CLOSE YOUR MINDS! IF IT'S NOT YOUR BAG, IT"S WRONG!

[Spoter]

loook smart(ass):you tried to make a comment on a paragraph that wasn't even ignorant, and yet you sounded pretty close minded and yourself.to each his own, i was just explaining how people that paint the same piece approach graffiti differently than the ones that paint a variety.

g.jesus:yeah i've mentioned the flicking thing too before.you can be super up with the same piece, but the ones that stick out in the memory of whoever caught it are gonna be the nice pieces.i think that's the difference between getting simply "spotted" and getting "noticed and flicked".and numbers don't mean as much as they should.both quantity and quality take effort in time.

[Smart]

Originally posted by >>>spot<<<
loook smart(ass):you tried to make a comment on a paragraph that wasn't even ignorant, and yet you sounded pretty close minded and yourself.to each his own, i was just explaining how people that paint the same piece approach graffiti differently than the ones that paint a variety.


well, looking back, it seemed that you said doing the 'the same thing', which could be anything, 1000 times is somehow worthless...

I was pointing out that to paint 1000 pieces, you would have to average a little less than 3 a day for a year or 1 a day for 3 years... if you only painted 1 a week, it would take nearly 20 years to paint 1000 pieces, so, it seems like a bit bigger effort than you're willing to give credit for...

then you called me 'kid', suggested that I don't paint, then you called me 'kid' AGAIN and suggested that I 'think I know something', implying, of course, that I know nothing. Further, you implied that I was close minded for pointing out the flaws in your words, instead of offering a blanket condemnation of countless other writers... ok, you win...

[dukeofyork]

goddammit, shut up already..
paint what the fuck you want, when you want, and quit fucking worrying about what other people think of your shit.




if you arent doing it for someone else, youll do what you want, be it the same outline every time, or something different every time.

[dukeofyork]

i thought that the whole point was to have fun and paint anyway....

[ExtraExtra]

anyone who does pieces and cant do a tag... has always been wack in my book.

[THEMISHE]

I don't see how anyone could be bored by Saber's pieces, especially his most recent ones, they have so much going its just fucking crazy. To each his own I guess.

[MONSTERKIDZ]

im not gonna mention any names BUT
i do agree that mosy of the kids u see pumped in the mags suck
and do not represent whos doing the best quality out there

[destroyall]

Originally posted by IMFINETHANKYOU
I don't see how anyone could be bored by Saber's pieces, especially his most recent ones, they have so much going its just fucking crazy. To each his own I guess.
i dont want to sound like im jumping on the bandwagon but saber is and always has been the man. not only does he come hard on just about everything he does, but its also the spots he gets. the majority of them are unbelievable.

[MONSTERKIDZ]

Saber is off the hook along with most of MSK
the kids i was thinking off hand
were the guys doing that cartoon 80's style that has become so played out
or the guys doing "abstract" pieces covering up the fact that
they have no letters
seems like the kids of today are all over that shapey crap

[AKTERONE LA!]

Word has it that the reason was like always sed" East coast has always hated on the West"...and shit like "Cope never liked LA also"....yo I don't really know...but I do agree with sum writters up in here and is better if this shit was just left alone...old newz...regardless SABER will still leave a mark in LA!!!;)

[Mr. Gerbik]

what the fuck are you talking about??????????????????????????

[9ign]

Originally posted by Mr. Gerbik
what the fuck are you talking about??????????????????????????

Yeah, what he said.

-9

[E-DubleSkilZ]

HUH?

[mosluggo]

Originally posted by 9ign


Yeah, what he said.

-9
Uh huh

[imported_super man 1]

gea gea

[SEone]

a lil bit of clarity!

[Smart]

I think he was replying to this thread... this one HERE!

[*die*]

Man this thread sucks what fuckin homo started this shit. :mad:

[wutangbanger]

i dont give a shit what other writers do but if i see some dope writer doing a wack peice i say its wack and move on i dont ponder... PERIOD MUTHER FUCKo HAHA

[wutangbanger]

only a TOY....... would start a topic like this one.. and only some one who writes DIE! haha just fuckin wit you am bored.. an out gunna smoke some herb peace..

[jeff123456]

Originally posted by GrImeY
theres a couple well known writers where Im from and its not that their shit is whack but that it is fucking repetitive. I mean Ive seen 200 of one of these guys freights and its the same 4 simple letters no changes pretty much every time. He might throw something new in every once in a while , but people still jock him like hes got the illest style ever. Fuck it I guess hes gotten up alot.

i rather see 200 of the same piece or throwie then have the guy do 200 pieces that arent very good

[PHYNE]

Originally posted by seeking
die, you really have no clue man... as far as im concerned ghost is a hundred times fresher than cope and loomit put together...

hell ya ghost is way iller.....peep them wholecars in that espo book...very fresh....:stretch: