Teachers can all die.

[ODS-1]

A student named Jay (who wants his last name to be withheld) at Brick Township High School in New Jersey, had his chair pulled out from under him after he refused to stand for the national anthem.

A student named Jay (who wants his last name to be withheld) at Brick Township High School in New Jersey, had his chair pulled out from under him after he refused to stand for the national anthem. The class started out that morning with the teacher Stuart Mantel yelling "I don't want to hear a sound! Not a sound! Morning exercises will come on, you will stand, you will stand quietly, you will pay attention! Any Questions!?...Now stand up and keep your mouths shut!" Students stood up as the national anthem began playing.

In the middle of the anthem, Mantel walked over to Jay and demanded that he stand up. Jay silently refused, and Mantel yelled again, "Stand up!". Jay then said "I don't have to stand up". To which Mantel insisted "You have to stand." Jay said "No I don't". Mantel then reached over and pulled Jay's chair out from under him. Jay responded to Mantel's outrageous behavior by asking him "Are you serious?", to which he yelled "I am damn well serious."

Jay said that he didn't have any political reasons for his refusal to stand but that he wanted to sit because he feels it is his right to do so and that right was being threatened by Mantel. Jay said that he thought Mantel might tell him to stand, but he never expected to be physically forced to do so.

Jay's friend who was in the class at the time, Corey, says that their teacher had been strict in the past in demanding that students stand for the national anthem and pledge of allegiance. That's why they brought in a camera - to expose the teacher in case he did anything again. "The teacher and school principals wanted him (Mantel) to press charges against us...they tried to blame it on us like it was premeditated, like we did it just to get him on tape, which is false. We knew he was gonna go nuts because he frequently used to" said Corey.

Jay's other classmate Steve got suspended for 10 days for filming the incident. The school told Corey that it "violated the teacher's constitutional rights" for them to film the teacher without his permission. "I think that its crazy that people are getting in trouble for this or things they say. There have been so many kids video taping and no one ever got in trouble for it. So why now?" Jay asked. It sounds as if the school is punishing this student now because of the nature of what's on the tape, not the fact they were taping the teacher without his permission.

When I asked Corey if Mantel was being punished for pulling out Jay's chair, he said "Nope...I asked (the principal) 'What are you doing to discipline Mantel?' and they said 'we talked'. Teachers do anything they want". Seeing acts like Mantel's go unpunished will likely inspire teachers to continue intimidating their students into standing for the national anthem and pledge of allegiance.

If you would like to let Brick Schools know how you feel about their handling of this situation, you may contact them here:

Brick Township Public Schools
Board of Education
101 Hendrickson Ave
Brick, NJ 08723
732-785-3000

Brick Township High School
346 Chambers Bridge Road
Brick, NJ 08723
(732)262-2500

[CACashRefund]

Videotaping the teacher harrass their student for not wanting to stand up for the pledge of allegiance is a vilolation of the TEACHERS constitutional rights?

[imported_El Mamerro]

Teacher's an asshole, kid's a dick.

[<KEY3>]

the assholes leading the dicks. [no homo]

If the kid is in his rights not to stand,
then the teacher is also in his rights to pull the chair.
The 'right' to ignore manners and be a prick is NOT
what your founding fathers had in mind when they
wrote the constitution.

[Dick Quickwood]

Originally posted by <KEY3>@Feb 21 2005, 07:22 PM
the assholes leading the dicks. [no homo]

If the kid is in his rights not to stand,
then the teacher is also in his rights to pull the chair.
The 'right' to ignore manners and be a prick is NOT
what your founding fathers had in mind when they
wrote the constitution.
Quoted post


the kid refusing to stand was not an attack or sign of animosity against any of the other people in the classroom. it is not the teacher's place to choose the students' on politics or patritiotism. i would say pulling a chair from under someone who is sitting is more than rude. what else do you think the teacher had the right to do? punch him in the face? teachers are held to a higher standard of behavior than their students. (i thought.) if the teacher had pulled that stunt out in the public, like in a sports stadium, it probably would not have gone over.

[ODS-1]

The kid wasn't violating anyone's personal space by not standing. But when this dick head teacher pulls a chair out from him, that's pretty much violating his "space". I mean shit, isn't it kind of dangerous to take something out from under someone while they're sitting on it? That kid should show up at that teachers home with a baseball bat.

[AW]

The kid got what he deserved!

[POIESIS]

why are you hating on all teachers?

[<KEY3>]

maybe it's just my inner old man....

I'd LOVE to see that kid refuse to stand in front of a bunch
of veterans who would then kick his ass and tell him to
'love it or leave it you damn commie'. I picture abe simpson
and his buddy jasper beating the kid with walking sticks.

[Nekro]

Originally posted by El Mamerro@Feb 21 2005, 09:05 PM
Teacher's an asshole, kid's a dick.
Quoted post

Teacher's got the power, so it's cool to be a dick.

[imported_El Mamerro]

Then it's also cool to be assholes towards dicks then. Assholes with power.


Don't get me wrong, I think the teacher's a complete fuckwad and should be fired, but that kid is a fucking prick for doing things for the sake of being an undisciplined punk (notice he gave no reasons as to why he did what he did). I have absolutely zero respect for little shits who think they are above everyone else and "excercise their rights" in order to irritate others.

[bodice_ripper]

Do you *have* to stand for these little prayer-substitutes?

[robJ]

If the kid didn't want to stand for the pledge, Fuck him. Teacher could of asked the student to leave his classroom, for being disruptive or feeling the this child was disrespecting his patritiotism. (thats what this is about right) But for the teacher to pull the chair out from under him is assault. Assault on a minor the way I see it. The teacher crossed the line,
How I see it..If this teacher was positive mentor , there would of never been any thoughts to bring a camera into the classroom, to film his disorderly conduct, reguardless. IF that was my boy, teacher would of been swallowing his car keys afterwork

[Dick Quickwood]

Originally posted by bodice_ripper@Feb 22 2005, 02:56 PM
Do you *have* to stand for these little prayer-substitutes?
Quoted post



when i was in school noone made anything of the kids who didn't stand

[Weapon X]

If that was my kid, I'd give a flogging he'd remember for a long, long time. And I'd probably let the teacher if I wasn't around to do it.

[CACashRefund]

Fuck that, if he didnt want to stand he should have just shown up late or not at all, thats the american way.

[metallix]

wow so much ignorance here. its totally legal not to stand up if you dont want to. there is case law behind this. and pulling a chair from underneath someone can cause injury. its bad someone got suspended for filming an abusive teacher. how else can someone expose abuse like this? just because this guy is a public school teacher does not give him authority to abuse people.

what ever happened to a democracy and freedom of speech?

[metallix]

Originally posted by Weapon X@Feb 22 2005, 08:16 PM
If that was my kid, I'd give a flogging he'd remember for a long, long time. And I'd probably let the teacher if I wasn't around to do it.
Quoted post


why would you physically abuse your child? would you like to be physically abused?

[villain]

Originally posted by ARCEL@Feb 22 2005, 07:55 PM
when i was in school noone made anything of the kids who didn't stand
Quoted post

Yeah that's what I thought.

[emergin_graffer]

the teacher shouldve been fired for doing shit like that. its bad enough that were raised for working for rich white corporate bastards. fuck school..its all bullshit. history is all lies and same with this patriotism. why do people wanna support a country that has murdered so many and keeps its citizens living in fear? that kid shouldve been allowed to sit if he didnt feel like participating in that bullshit.

[metallix]

Originally posted by emergin_graffer@Feb 22 2005, 10:37 PM
the teacher shouldve been fired for doing shit like that. its bad enough that were raised for working for rich white corporate bastards. fuck school..its all bullshit. history is all lies and same with this patriotism. why do people wanna support a country that has murdered so many and keeps its citizens living in fear? that kid shouldve been allowed to sit if he didnt feel like participating in that bullshit.
Quoted post

[Nekro]

I'm still in high school and have stood up for the pledge twice (first day of freshman year, september 11, 2002 at 8:46). I got shit about it once or twice, but everything was cool after I explained that Quakers don't swear on the bible or salute the flag.

[<KEY3>]

wait..... nekro is a quaker?

[why write?]

man, fuck teachers....they think they own everything and can boss people around and shit but when they go home their nobody once again

the kid didnt wanna stand, why the fuck does the teacher give a fuck...whats the big deal, the teacher just wants to have authority and control over people while they are at school so they can feel good about themselves....okay the kid had no reason, but he doesnt need a reason...its his right as a US citizen....he shouldnt be forced to do shit

[ctrl+alt+del]

Originally posted by <KEY3>@Feb 21 2005, 06:22 PM
If the kid is in his rights not to stand,
then the teacher is also in his rights to pull the chair.
The 'right' to ignore manners and be a prick is NOT
what your founding fathers had in mind when they
wrote the constitution.
Quoted post



blahblahblahblah. you people and your righteousness, trying to invoke the LAW. you want to invoke law, ok then lets speak in pure legality of the situation.
teachers are bound by rules, students are bound by rules. fuck what you know about constitutional rights, because the constitution makes everyone equal, so they are both on equal terms.
BUT BACK TO THE RULES PUT ON STAFF AND STUDENTS BY THE SCHOOL
For the teacher to be put on the right side of the law there must be
some form of explicit law that STATES that the student must stand for the pledge of allegiance
this would be found in
-a Schools Code of Conduct
the student is obligated to obey the code of conduct (rules,whatever) if he explicitly or tacitly consents.
-the teachers own material on classroom rules or laws
the student is obligated to obey the rules if he explicitly or tacitly consents
IF YA DONT KNOW
explicit consent is like saying I WILL FOLLOW or signing your name
tacit consent is like being in the presence of whatever, its passive. you know the rules of the school and you still come to school every day, as an example
NOW
you might think by being in the room, the student is tacitly consenting to the teachers rules
BUT
-if one clearly and publicly dissents, he is NOT tacitly consenting to the rules.
by sitting down, and refusing to do the pledge, the student is NOT CONSENTING TO THE RULES OF THE CLASSROOM.
and no schools write anything in their code of conduct about standing for the pledge, and no teacher would either, so its pretty safe to say that the kid didnt explicitly consent to the pledge.

SO
the kid had every fucking right to do what he did.
and not only that, but the teacher is clearly violating the students own rights, and this would be so terribly easy to prove, shit you got video of a teacher acting like a temper tantrum throwing 4 year old. or at least thats how id paint him. id have his paychecks coming to me for years if i was in charge of the case.

and the fact that the law would stand with the kid on this is a testament to the vitality of the constitution. if the law backed the teacher, then everyone with any authority could take advantage of anyone below them. the law should protect those that need its protection, it SHOULD be a defense shield for the small man.

by the way, background note.
if your school did the pledge of allegiance all together, lead by somebody over the intercom/PA system, that was my job. i lead the pledge of allegiance for 5,000 students and staff everyday for a year, so dont come at me with COMMIE LIBERAL PINKO shit. yeah the kid might be a dick, i knew tons of kids like him in high school, and they were all dicks. but if the teacher is going to physical lengths to force conformity, then thats not right. and im sure we are getting an extremely biased version of what happened here, but IF the situation that we are given was the real situation, well, then you already know how i feel about it.

i still think your dope though zesto

[Weapon X]

Originally posted by metallix+Feb 22 2005, 09:18 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (metallix - Feb 22 2005, 09:18 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-Weapon X@Feb 22 2005, 08:16 PM
If that was my kid, I'd give a flogging he'd remember for a long, long time.*** And I'd probably let the teacher if I wasn't around to do it.
Quoted post


why would you physically abuse your child? would you like to be physically abused?
Quoted post
[/b][/quote]

Why would I physically abuse my child? Man, I can't answer that. Well, I can answer by assuming that you are what is wrong with socitety these days. Hardcore, extreme, directionless Liberalism. You are doing the Devil's handywork by coddling your child when he refuses to respect his nation - the nation that allows him to live the way he does - or his teacher.

[imported_El Mamerro]

None of what has been said so far makes the kid any less of a dick.


Listen, nobody's arguing that the teacher doesn't deserve to get booted, or hopefully even sued, but it amazes me just how many of you are ready to defend (and even encourage) the kid's actions as perfectly reasonable and OK.

The issue is not whether he had or didn't have to stand up, it's whether he chose to do it or not. Yes, of course it's in his legal right to refuse to stand, and no, he doesn't have to give a reason. But there's this itty bitty thing called respect and courtesy for the beliefs and opinions of your peers that gets immediately thrown out the window the minute you decide to adopt a confrontational and alienating behavior, which gets even worse when you refuse to explain or open some line of dialogue that can help others understand and respect why you did what you did.

I know many of use think the way we do (liberally) because we envision a more tolerant society, where people are free to say what they believe in, and where diversity of opinion and culture will lead to a rich, accepting, unified society. The first step in achieving this is for us to respect (respect ≠ believing in) the traditions of our culture, even if we don't passionately believe in them, because respecting these traditions means respecting the people around you. When I stand for the pledge, I don't do it to salute my country, or to state with joyful glee that we are a nation under God... I don't even put my hand on my chest. But I stand, I stand because I acknowledge how strongly some people feel about this and I want to express that acknowledgement of their beliefs. I would like to expect them to do the same when it comes to my beliefs, but their reciprocation is not a factor on whether I choose to acknowledge theirs; I'll still hold up on my part, and I will die with a clear conscience because of it.

Freedom of speech is at its core a unifying ideal, but it can be easily used as a divisive principle depending on the attitude we adopt and the decisions we make when exercising it. When this kid acted the way he did, the end result was divisive and confrontational, and led to a downward spiral that instead of sparking meaningful dialogue, brought hostility and bickering that set both sides even further apart. He achieved the exact opposite of what freedom of speech hopes to attain for us.

Do your part, man. When you use your freedom of speech, think about the very reason it exists.

[ledzep]

^exactly! Use don't abuse.

If people use freedom of speech to be obnoxious and insulting it only gives more merit to getting rid of it.

[AW]

I'm sure most people here are younger than me so you might not remember corporal punishment. I'd get popped at school and have black and blue marks from it.

When I was growing up, you got whipped for doing something wrong.
EVERYONE got whipped for doing something wrong!!!
That taught you that there was painful consequences for your actions.

It wasn't abuse, and you where weary of doing the same thing twice.
Now a days you get Time Out.

Time out is good for little bitty children, but once your old enough to know better, you need to be punished a little more severely.

A lot of kids I've seen these days are real smart asses because their parents or teachers never got to humble them with a good ass whipping.

What the world needs more of is less guns and more old school ass whippings!

[ODS-1]

School is just lies and bullshit to get you ready for the corporate world. I have yet to use anything I learned when I was in school. I didn't learn anything related to the career I want, and I was told that Colombus came over and gave the indians food and had a feast with them and then they just "gave" their land to white people. It's all bullshit. I've been on "lockdown" in a school before while police came in the search for drugs in someones locker. Does that sound like a school or a prison?

[POIESIS]

man...some of you are being a little dramatic..
the school system is many things, and it's true what
some of you are saying to an extent, but it's not the
ONLY thing school is. it's not 'all bullshit' and it's not
all teachers faults and all teachers aren't power trippin'
assholes.

[AW]

What's wrong with Corporate America?

Everything you use or buy is a product of it. Without Corporate America, you wouldn't be doing graffitti or much of anything else!

[metallix]

Originally posted by ODS-1@Feb 23 2005, 10:48 AM
School is just lies and bullshit to get you ready for the corporate world. I have yet to use anything I learned when I was in school. I didn't learn anything related to the career I want, and I was told that Colombus came over and gave the indians food and had a feast with them and then they just "gave" their land to white people. It's all bullshit. I've been on "lockdown" in a school before while police came in the search for drugs in someones locker. Does that sound like a school or a prison?
Quoted post


School = Mental Prison

[metallix]

Originally posted by AW@Feb 23 2005, 11:15 AM
What's wrong with Corporate America?

Everything you use or buy is a product of it. Without Corporate America, you wouldn't be doing graffitti or much of anything else!
Quoted post


What's wrong with questioning corporate America?

http://www.opensecrets.org/

Corporate America exists to make a profit. Why should making a profit depend on the subjugation of the working classes both mentally and physically, essentially forever?

[ERIZENO]

Originally posted by ARCEL+Feb 23 2005, 12:55 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ARCEL - Feb 23 2005, 12:55 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-bodice_ripper@Feb 22 2005, 02:56 PM
Do you *have* to stand for these little prayer-substitutes?
Quoted post



when i was in school noone made anything of the kids who didn't stand
Quoted post
[/b][/quote]
Pre 9/11 right???
It’s a new world, and patriotism is the new religion.

[AW]

Originally posted by metallix@Feb 23 2005, 06:48 PM
Corporate America exists to make a profit. Why should making a profit depend on the subjugation of the working classes both mentally and physically, essentially forever?
Quoted post


So what's your solution???????

No matter where you go it's the same, so it really makes no difference. Germany, England etc.

Japan's is 100 times worse than America when it comes to the so called "subjugation of the working classes both mentally and physically".

I guess you'll be turning Amish any day now.

Corporate America Rules! There's a lot of Money to be made out there.

[POIESIS]

perfect argument^

[POIESIS]

really..

[AW]

I figured out that a students schooling experience is directly proportional to the amount of homework and participation they do.

If you participate and do what's assigned, you will probably have a good time. All the smart kids don't seem to bitch to much, and they always seemed happy.

On the other hand, if your not listening or doing your homework, you would probably have a shitty school experience.

School is what YOU make of it.

[mental invalid]

Originally posted by El Mamerro@Feb 22 2005, 02:05 AM
Teacher's an asshole, kid's a dick.
Quoted post




yep....and ditto what zesto said...

[ODS-1]

Corporate america: CEO's have 3 cars, a huge house with a gate, and a "summer home". They make god knows how much a year, maybe millions. They can afford anything they want, and have more than what they need to get by. Do these people actually do anything? They run a company that makes some bullshit that nobody really needs. They have enough money that they don't have to work in their company's dirty ass factory.

Meanwhile in the factory of that CEO's company, someone is working their ass of making minimum wage, barely making enough to buy clothes for their kids. Why does the CEO make more than the person making the CEO's product?
People are making money off of sex in corporate america. Capitalizing off of your natural desires.

[imported_El Mamerro]

This thread is getting drowned in stupid.

[Nekro]

Originally posted by El Mamerro@Feb 24 2005, 01:34 PM
This thread is getting drowned in stupid.
Quoted post

Indeed.

Regardless of the fact that the kid's a douche bag and had no reason for doing this other than to be a pain in the ass, the teacher's in the wrong far more than the student is because he brought physical violence into his classroom. Say what you will about the motives, but the teacher's the one that pulled the chair out.

[AW]

Originally posted by ODS-1@Feb 24 2005, 06:07 PM
Corporate america: CEO's have 3 cars, a huge house with a gate, and a "summer home". They make god knows how much a year, maybe millions. They can afford anything they want, and have more than what they need to get by. Do these people actually do anything? They run a company that makes some bullshit that nobody really needs. They have enough money that they don't have to work in their company's dirty ass factory.

Meanwhile in the factory of that CEO's company, someone is working their ass of making minimum wage, barely making enough to buy clothes for their kids. Why does the CEO make more than the person making the CEO's product?
People are making money off of sex in corporate america. Capitalizing off of your natural desires.
Quoted post


You can say the same shit about Athletes and Rappers etc.
I don't mean to single you out, but you need to learn a little more about how Corpoarate America works.

For example Gordon Bethune CEO of Continental Airlines, brought them out of bankrupcy and turned the airlines into a fortune 100 company.

He actually turned down his yearly bonuses and was a strategic spearhed for the company (he just retired).

He started out as part of the maintenance crew and worked his way up to CEO.

That's America, that's Capitalism, and that's what America is built on.

All your food, clothes car, music, entertainment, television, games, etc is all part of Corporate America.

I see no part of your argument that is valid whatsoever. Education opens a lot of doors.

[metallix]

nevermind

[ODS-1]

I'm not talking continental airlines. We need that. It's no fucking use arguing with someone like you.

[AW]

I'm not arguing with you.
Your comment just makes no sense to me.

[ODS-1]

We need airplanes. We need pilots to fly them. But do we need people slaving their ass of to make some stupid martha stewart bullshit that nobody needs?

[metallix]

^ yes capitalism produces lots of useless crap nobody needs or wants. in theory the market should decide what is useless and not. but in theory everything is perfect and in reality nothing is.

essentially a lot of those jobs just exist to give people jobs. just like school is a massive jobs progrAM, keeping young people from seeking employment...

[ODS-1]

???????????Waaa?

[ERIZENO]

Originally posted by ODS-1@Feb 25 2005, 12:18 AM
???????????Waaa?
Quoted post

you got taken to school ....
what this tangent argument boils down to is :::this is a shitty system of living that leaves a lot to be desired, however with humans involved its the best one out there. you put out the effort you make the cash, you wait around wanting life to be handed to you and your ass out.
so your thoughts are corrrect, yet its futile to expect anything else can ever exist(and function well anyway).

[bodice_ripper]

When I got sent home from school for refusing to mouth the words to the Our Father, my parents brought me right back and told the school to shove it. And the was in IRELAND. In the EIGHTIES.

How backward is the US becoming?

[Gates]

fuck that..some teach pull my chair i'm swingin..i never stand up for the pledge at school..fuck that shit..last time my teach said i should leave the country if i don't get up for the pledge..fuck that someone touch me i'm swingin

[foneiz2]

teacher should of fucked that disobediant kid up and jacked his friends camera.

[taper]

if you get the time pick up the book "the bible vs. the flag" its about all the cases in which the pledge of alligance in schools and the commuinty was protested and the court cases that came from it. to make a long story short this already went on numerous times and has been taken to the supreme court. there are court precedents that will make this case a open and shut one if they choose. it is 100% against the rights of students/teachers ect. for anyone to make them say or stand for the pledge. its over and done with. i cant belive a teacher would do such a thing. i say take it to court sue that fucker of a teacher and the school. thats bullshit. do some research its all there they got a nice case :king:

[postmodernism]

The teachers actions could have easily
resulted in an injury. I would say the
kid is an asshole but the teacher could
easily have brought a lawsuit to the district
The teacher was in the wrong. People like
that shouldnt become teachers anyway

[AW]

If my kid didn't stand for the pledge of allegiance just to be an disrespectful, I'd smack him myself!

Show some fucking respect! That's the problem with kids these days. They want all the respect, but don't want to give any out.

You should be proud that you're in this country in the first place.

On the other hand, I started to rebel in 7th grade and I understand the attitude that some kids have. Punk Rock music was my new allegiance and I didn't listen to anyone.

[imported_dowmagik]

you guys think that is whack? when i was in high school one of my ex junior high teachers hit a student with a stick and left welts because the kid was acting a fool on a field trip. nothing happened to the teacher. lemme also add that this teacher would write your name on shotgun shells instead of the blackboard if were actin up. for realla

[knuckle_game]

"Gordon Bethune CEO of Continental Airlines, brought them out of bankrupcy and turned the airlines into a fortune 100 company.

He actually turned down his yearly bonuses and was a strategic spearhed for the company (he just retired).

He started out as part of the maintenance crew and worked his way up to CEO.

That's America, that's Capitalism, and that's what America is built on."


Thats america, that's capitalism, and thats like .000000000001% percent of the population. The rest of us have a life of underpaying expolitative, dead end jobs.

"All your food, clothes car, music, entertainment, television, games, etc is all part of Corporate America."

Actually most of that shit comes form good ole communist china. Does that mean we should unquestioningly idolize china's political system?

[AW]

Originally posted by knuckle_game+Mar 2 2005, 08:02 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (knuckle_game - Mar 2 2005, 08:02 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>The rest of us have a life of underpaying expolitative, dead end jobs.
Quoted post
[/b]

Who's fault is that?
Your own, not Corporate America!!!

<!--QuoteBegin-knuckle_game@Mar 2 2005, 08:02 PM
Actually most of that shit comes form good ole communist china. Does that mean we should unquestioningly idolize china's political system?Quoted post
[/quote]

Mike Tyson does.

[H of BL]

It is completely in the kids rights to not stand if he doesnt want to. And Maybe he wasnt not standing because he wanted to be a pain in the ass. Maybe he was not standing because he knew that it was completely within his rights and it shouldbe one of those things that people dont even notice.

Even if he was just doing it to be a pain in the ass the teacher definitly did not respond in the right way. Maybe if the teacher had just ignored it the kid would have stopped. If he was doing it to annoy the teacher but the teacher didnt get annoyed, what would be the point. If he was doing it just because he was tired and didnt feel like like standing up then it shouldnt be a problem.

[AW]

Spare the rod, spoil the child!

[ERIZENO]

Originally posted by AW@Mar 3 2005, 09:36 PM
Spare the rod, spoil the child!
Quoted post

thats bullshit ..........

thats man trying to act holy.
in my view ... but come on.

[H of BL]

Originally posted by AW@Mar 3 2005, 04:36 PM
Spare the rod, spoil the child!
Quoted post


Why do you always hove to be an asshole?

[xwibxonex]

Originally posted by <KEY3>@Feb 22 2005, 08:36 PM
maybe it's just my inner old man....

I'd LOVE to see that kid refuse to stand in front of a bunch
of veterans who would then kick his ass and tell him to
'love it or leave it you damn commie'. I picture abe simpson
and his buddy jasper beating the kid with walking sticks.
Quoted post



i'd LOVE (not really.. just mocking your ignorant ass)
for you to pull your head out of your bum to stop and think ..
1st of all: those veterans were (supposed to be?) fighting for those rights which THIS KID WAS EXERCISING. thank you.
and you've resorted tocalling someone a commie because they don't agree
with the way things are being run for THOUSANDS (see posts by any
"liberals" on this site) of reasons? have you ever seen a communist nation? have you ever been personally effected by one? thank you.

[xwibxonex]

[/quote]
Indeed.

Regardless of the FACT that the kid's a douche bag and had no reason for doing this other than to be a pain in the ass, the teacher's in the wrong far more than the student is because he brought physical violence into his classroom. Say what you will about the motives, but the teacher's the one that pulled the chair out.
Quoted post
[/quote]

not arguing with you btw

i must have missed those facts. I'm not against america. I don't have a problem with our flag. I just think they'res A HUGE FUCKING IRONY in some of these people arguing over people who WONT STAND for the fucking SYMBOL OF THEIR FREEDOM. helllooo think about it... clicking yet? pretty much.. while you guys are sucking freedoms dick.. we're out here using it to live our lives the way we'd like.

[26SidedCube]

Originally posted by Fryre Dekoy@Mar 17 2005, 01:26 PM
while you guys are sucking freedoms dick.. we're out here using it to live our lives the way we'd like.
Quoted post

[GEEB]

Brains is what makes our money. not our hands.

[insane30]

well doen here in miami......the schoolboard acts like the constitution doesnt exist.....there is NO SELF DEFENSE....yes an AP has said that if 6 guys jump you with bats and knifes and you hit back you both get equal punishemtn.....also the student is supposed to do whatever the teacher tells him or her to do nomatter what it is, now of course kids havefits and get their way but onyl cuz the teacher is a lazy fuck who only knows wat the fuken fuken pythagorean thyreum is but htey could make u do anything...now in my opinion thats total bullshit but then again its us against the system aint it....FUCK THE SYSTEM!!!

[Overtime]

the whole issue is stupid. The kid. The teacher. I would feel inclined to back one of them up if either had a valid reason for choosing what they did. You know the kid sat there with the intention of causing a problem, like most high school kids do, he was trying to push his limits. The teacher, wanted to prove the he was the one in power. Teachers should have more right to do things like that, because kids are getting more and more power in schools. To hear the stories from teachers and other kids, its outrageous that they let things like this go on. Go Mr. Mantel, put that little bastard in his place.

[Overtime]

Originally posted by insane30@Mar 18 2005, 05:00 PM
well doen here in miami......the schoolboard acts like the constitution doesnt exist.....there is NO SELF DEFENSE....yes an AP has said that if 6 guys jump you with bats and knifes and you hit back you both get equal punishemtn.....also the student is supposed to do whatever the teacher tells him or her to do nomatter what it is, now of course kids havefits and get their way but onyl cuz the teacher is a lazy fuck who only knows wat the fuken fuken pythagorean thyreum is but htey could make u do anything...now in my opinion thats total bullshit but then again its us against the system aint it....FUCK THE SYSTEM!!!
Quoted post



sweet spelling, did you graduate?

Yeah, thats how it is here. If you are even in a fight, you get in trouble. I had a friends, whose girlfriend told him she did not want him to fight, he was jumped, did not move a finger, and got the same exact punishment as the other kids.

There are no two ways about it, our "education" system is fucked up to say the least.

[villain]

Teachers should not be pulling chairs from under their students.

[Overtime]

Why not? Do not get me wrong, I do not think that teachers should have all the right to hit children or something of that nature, but if a kid is being unruley, and there is nothing a teacher can do, why not pull a chair, or something like that? Putting kids in ISS or related punishments just do not do anything

[Æ°]

I think sending the kid home would be the rational thing to do. A teacher should not exploit a student to satisfy a self-serving emotional desire.

It's a situation of two people not being able to control their emotions, but I think the teacher has an obligation to act more professional in a situation like this. After all, they're supposed to be teaching the kids something useful. Fighting a tantrum with a tantrum is not a valuable lesson.

I give this teacher an F

[bigpoppa.k]

I think a lot of people are missing the big picture here.
This has nothing to do with excersing your rights, or corporate america.

I've noticed that kids nowadays generally don't give a shit about anyone or anything and most of the time not even themselves.
They've got no respect, give no respect, have no character or any integrity and don't do ANYTHING to build any of it. Theres a serious lack of motivation here and among other thngs (some of which i mentioned), are going to be the downfall of the "great nation" that is the united states of america. your own attitude is going to come back and bite you in the ass.

A lot of you guys are willing to lynch the teacher for what he did, and i'm not saying it was right, but its kids like this that are going to be running the world in 40 years.
Me personally... I don't want that snot nose little piece of shit telling my grandkids what to do or how to live.
What happens when you've got a whole nation of people who act like this kid does? Fucking mayhem is what you've got.
And while all this is happening you've got china over there on the other side of the world quietly becoming the next almighty superpower. You think chinese kids act like this to their teachers or parents? hahahaha... yeah right.

So while we're all at the ages to have kids, when and if you do, think about punishing your kids properly, putting your kids to work, building character and integrity, teaching them respect... because there's kids like this 12oz. member running around.

"-- Gates
fuck that..some teach pull my chair i'm swingin..i never stand up for the pledge at school..fuck that shit..last time my teach said i should leave the country if i don't get up for the pledge..fuck that someone touch me i'm swingin"


and whoever turned this into a corporate america debate is an idiot. blame the parents before you blame anybody.

[Overtime]

I basically was trying to say the same thing as you did, but you succeeded much more. Thanks.

[sleepyceas2-]

"Sitting at the table doesn’t make you a diner. You must be eating some of what’s on that plate. Being here in America doesn’t make you an American. Being born here in America doesn’t make you an American."
"The Ballot or the Bullet," speech, April 3 1964, Cleveland, Ohio (published in Malcolm X Speaks, ch. 3, 1965).

[oneeightyone]

Originally posted by AW@Feb 23 2005, 10:46 AM
I'm sure most people here are younger than me so you might not remember corporal punishment. I'd get popped at school and have black and blue marks from it.

When I was growing up, you got whipped for doing something wrong.
EVERYONE got whipped for doing something wrong!!!
That taught you that there was painful consequences for your actions.

It wasn't abuse, and you where weary of doing the same thing twice.
Now a days you get Time Out.

Time out is good for little bitty children, but once your old enough to know better, you need to be punished a little more severely.

A lot of kids I've seen these days are real smart asses because their parents or teachers never got to humble them with a good ass whipping.

What the world needs more of is less guns and more old school ass whippings!
Quoted post

Thank you,

My mom used to beat the shit out of me, that set me straight, im down for some discipline and it's not abuse, whoever said it was abuse is a pussy, straight up, if a kid gets out of line, whoop his ass dont let him get away with it, dont send him to his room where he has all the shit he could ask for, pop him one in the eyeball.

that's my rant.

[dirtyhoodrat]

My mom used to beat the shit out of me, that set me straight, im down for some discipline and it's not abuse, whoever said it was abuse is a pussy, straight up, if a kid gets out of line, whoop his ass dont let him get away with it, dont send him to his room where he has all the shit he could ask for, pop him one in the eyeball.

that's my rant. >>>


i got beat with a 2 by 4 so much as a child, i seriously drew on it with my markers because i saw the damn thing so much. but i still don't think it's a teacher place to act like that, leave the beatings for the parents.

[willy.wonka]

i was once threatened to be suspended after a securityguard that just got out of jail on coke charges tried to pull me out of my classroom and into the bathroom to fight with me.

he reasons were that i looked like a punk.

[ghost citizen]

this is a good topic because i agree with so much of whats being said on both sides. but i get frustrated when people use terms like "liberal" as a way of discrediting the values a person has. i feel the same way about the word "conservatives" or whatever. Thats ignorant to use slurs and turn your ears from someone rather that arguing their points.
bottomline, teachers should be able to yell at your kids and certainly not fuck with them like that. You don't like what the kids doing send him to the office. As for the kid getting suspended for video taping it, I hope he gets a good lawyer and sells that tape to the mainstream media. It's like video taping an abusive nanny, you arent violating her rights.

[S@T@N]

Okay, so these kids decide they want to catch this teacher
being an asshole on tape. So Jay decides to remain seated
during the anthem while the other kid tapes the reaction.


I don't understand what Jay did wrong. Jay wasn't necessarily
doing it to piss everyone off, he was doing it to expose an
abusive rat bastard.


I'm not denying he could've just been doing it to be an ass,
and in that case, he did need to be disciplined. It's just dumb
to hear you guys automatically assuming the worst case.

[SF1]

If that were my kid... I'd beat the shit out of that scumbag nazi teacher!!!

[SF1]

In my day if we didn't want to stand for the pledge you didn't have to and it wasn't a big deal. This is a sign of the fascist times and how their brainwashing kids to be future fascists. After a certain age I never stood for the pledge.

[Neskoner]

i never stood for that shit once they told me i had a choice..

[useurname]

I'm glad I dont go to school anymore. How did that kid get an electronic device into school? I thought you couldn't bring shit like that to school, or at least thats how it is where I come from.

[MAGS156]

Shoot em all and let god sort em out!

[emergin_graffer]

Originally posted by useurname@Apr 4 2005, 12:23 AM
I'm glad I dont go to school anymore. How did that kid get an electronic device into school? I thought you couldn't bring shit like that to school, or at least thats how it is where I come from.
Quoted post


you put it in your backpack.. :burn:

[iloveyoursister]

Originally posted by ODS-1@Feb 23 2005, 01:16 AM
The kid wasn't violating anyone's personal space by not standing. But when this dick head teacher pulls a chair out from him, that's pretty much violating his "space". I mean shit, isn't it kind of dangerous to take something out from under someone while they're sitting on it? That kid should show up at that teachers home with a baseball bat.
Quoted post

Word.

[the_gooch]

Originally posted by ARCEL+Feb 21 2005, 10:59 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ARCEL - Feb 21 2005, 10:59 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-<KEY3>@Feb 21 2005, 07:22 PM
the assholes leading the dicks. [no homo]

If the kid is in his rights not to stand,
then the teacher is also in his rights to pull the chair.
The 'right' to ignore manners and be a prick is NOT
what your founding fathers had in mind when they
wrote the constitution.
Quoted post


the kid refusing to stand was not an attack or sign of animosity against any of the other people in the classroom. it is not the teacher's place to choose the students' on politics or patritiotism. i would say pulling a chair from under someone who is sitting is more than rude. what else do you think the teacher had the right to do? punch him in the face? teachers are held to a higher standard of behavior than their students. (i thought.) if the teacher had pulled that stunt out in the public, like in a sports stadium, it probably would not have gone over.
Quoted post
[/b][/quote]


yeah i agree, the teacher had no right to take it that far. i have students that do that all the time and all i do is remind them that kids their age or a little bit older are over in iraq getting blown up. whatever their political views are they always get up.

[wAndEreR]

inless ur in a wheelchair u should jus stand the fukk up..

[ODS-1]

^^^That was one of the most ignorant things I've heard in a while.