Welcome to the THE WRITERS FORUM brought to you by 12ozPROPHET...
You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which only gives you limited access to view our discussions, photos and other forum features. By joining THE WRITERS FORUM community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access other member only features. Registration is fast, simple and free, so join THE WRITERS FORUM today and be a part of the largest and longest running graffiti, street arts and popular culture forum online!
If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
WHATS WORSE????? STATE YOUR OPINION -
03-05-2002, 03:41 AM
when it comes to graffiti, alot of people think its all about being illegal. which for the most part it is... or so thats what most think, i assume. getting up illegally, like bombing helps develope your skills, and is a very important part of graffiti.
now is:
...growing/coming up on a legal wall, or a chill wall(that is so chill it might as well be legal) worse? in your opinion, and why?
i'd just like to know what you think about that issue.
*note* its not over if graffiti should be illegal or not, its simply dealing with whether or not there is a big difference between growing/coming up on a legal wall or a wall thats so chill it might as well be legal.
i'm just kinda curious because i get tired of people yelling at other people for being: 'legal eagles' when i know of writers who 'came up' or 'developed' there skills on a wall that IS so chill it might as well be legal... but no one would dare call them a 'legal eagle' or accuse them of being a toy.
gee, what could have spurred this discusion? If you're an established writer who turns to legal work for whatever personal reasons I really don't see why you should get frowned upon. Sometimes you get to a point in your life where its not worth the risk anymore, and everyones gotta make there own decisions.
But if your starting out doing mostly legal work and not learning a lot of lessons in the yard or the street than thats somthing different altogether. Legal walls are a place to get complicated, and stretch your mind. Its healthy when combined with lots of illegal work, or as an alternative to getting busted if you're on parole or somthing. I'm not gonna knock anyone who breaks out the ghetto blaster and lawn chairs to spend a sunday painting with friends...frankly I look forward to being somewhere where I will have a chance to do that. But if thats 90% of what you do, and you've never put in much illegal work I wouldn't think of you as a "real" writer (as much as I loathe that term).
The quality of your work is what matters in the end, the rest is just a semantic argument really...
Originally posted by kaesthebluntedwonder either way the main concern should be producing GOOD work in the end
couldn't agree more
Two muffins are sitting in the oven. The first muffin says, "wow its really hot in here". Muffin two says, "HOLY SHIT!! A TALKIN MUFFIN!!!"
------------------------------------------------
<img src=\'http://www.vicnet.net.au/products/promotions/owl_images/night_owl_logo.gif\' border=\'0\' alt=\'user posted image\' />
ESE- first off thank you for you explanation. and secondly, it has nothing to do with me, cuz i know thats what your thinking. i could care less about what people think about me.
i just dont see the point in being 'double standard'. like treating one person one way but not the other.
Originally posted by tue skinny writers dont think of it as illegal we see it as a totally different perspective. other people who are against this art say its illegal
speak for yourself. I see it as illegal, but I obviously don't feel its wrong. I see this all the time..."graffiti is not a crime!" YES IT IS! but its a fun one, that doesn't really hurt anyone. Don't pull any punches about what we do...
Originally posted by shameless self promotion *moved to third rail*
MODS- i ask that you dont do that, i get more responses here, thats why its in here. i know its suppost to go in third rail, however the newbies opinions arent the ones im after.
Originally posted by cmeup ESE- first off thank you for you explanation. and secondly, it has nothing to do with me, cuz i know thats what your thinking. i could care less about what people think about me.
i just dont see the point in being 'double standard'. like treating one person one way but not the other.
thats all im saying, ya know?
tease
I see what your getting at. I think the reason that the "double standard" exists is because the persons opinion is more than just the sheer esthetics of the piece. Its the work that went into doing it. I got more respect for a burner if it was on a sick rooftop, than if it was at a legal, cause I know the work the writer put into doing it. But I'd still appriciate the legal...its just less impressive. I mean, its impossible to remove the surroundings from the piece when you make a judgement...if you did youd treat a simple pannel the same as a wholecar with the same outline, and you know that never happens.
The stupid "keep it real" people who slam on "legal eagles" arent worth worrying about, and I think thats alot of what your getting at...
I just hate the people that think the first thing they ever paint should be with a can of belton and a gold cap pulling up to a legal wall....Thats not writing, its like Suburbia writing....
Okay, Tease... I know you're sick of my shit (haha), but just listen to MY opinion, as I listened to yours. Don't get offended PLEASE!
To me, going to a chill spot when you first start is okay. It's good to practice some can control and get some decent letters. I like legal walls because you can take your time, and flex your shit. But going to that same legal spot over and over again seems pointless to me. Might as well paint your backyard.
I don't think it's all about being illegal, but I'm crazy about location. That's why I love traveling... I may not be the best, or even close to the best, but the more people see me and recognize me, the better. Why do you think people paint freights? Sure, it's fun and you're doing it for "yourself", but whoever says they don't care who sees it has gotta be lying to themselves...
The whole legal wall concept is so general. You can't compare kids that paint the same legal wall over and over again because they're scared to go out to people that paint them to do burners.
I see what your getting at. I think the reason that the "double standard" exists is because the persons opinion is more than just the sheer esthetics of the piece. Its the work that went into doing it. I got more respect for a burner if it was on a sick rooftop, than if it was at a legal, cause I know the work the writer put into doing it. But I'd still appriciate the legal...its just less impressive. I mean, its impossible to remove the surroundings from the piece when you make a judgement...if you did youd treat a simple pannel the same as a wholecar with the same outline, and you know that never happens.
The stupid "keep it real" people who slam on "legal eagles" arent worth worrying about, and I think thats alot of what your getting at...
word man, word.
you got the jist of what im saying, but when you went into those examples of yours, you missed my point.
with your examples i totally agree. ive been around a long time. im not 'up the most' , im not 'killing shit' ...but i do know: talent when i see it, and i know about 'graffiti and the history' trust me, ya know? so your point is very very on point.
however, my main point is that, whether or not you grew up on a legal, and by growing up i mean got your skills down(like cleanlyness for example) ...not stayed there your whole 'career' but you did it "legally"
and i dont see the difference between that, and growing up on some chill as wall, that is so chill it might as well be legal, and getting your skills there at this 'illegal' wall.
thats where the double standards to me comes into play... and thats all im trying to discuss. you got tha jist of it, it just bothers me seeing people call others toys or dissing others, when they themselves or other people ive seen 'come up' or 'develope as a writer' started off at something similiar...that being tha "illegal, but so chill it could be legal" wall.
thanks for your input once again, if you got more to say i'd love to hear it.
Originally posted by Secret Okay, Tease... I know you're sick of my shit (haha), but just listen to MY opinion, as I listened to yours. Don't get offended PLEASE!
To me, going to a chill spot when you first start is okay. It's good to practice some can control and get some decent letters. I like legal walls because you can take your time, and flex your shit. But going to that same legal spot over and over again seems pointless to me. Might as well paint your backyard.
I don't think it's all about being illegal, but I'm crazy about location. That's why I love traveling... I may not be the best, or even close to the best, but the more people see me and recognize me, the better. Why do you think people paint freights? Sure, it's fun and you're doing it for "yourself", but whoever says they don't care who sees it has gotta be lying to themselves...
The whole legal wall concept is so general. You can't compare kids that paint the same legal wall over and over again because they're scared to go out to people that paint them to do burners.
word secret, your mostly on point. i think your trying to get at me a bit in there, which is okay, but it wasnt about me... (im not mad at you either, on yoru opinion in here or other thread)
i was just trying to prove a point, kinda like in the other thread. this one though about being 'double standard' to certain kids... feel me?
but its cool, thanks for your input to... cya soon...
to me its like this..you're going to encounter chill spots/legals in your life..why not paint them?but its the illegal spots that make you a faster/more effective writer..revok is a perfect example..im sure he rocks those wild spots in a speedy amount of time..he bombs..hard..then he goes to do a legal and its just that much better...i bet he finishes a legal wall very fast...i think bombing really helps your technique.
Originally posted by Wilt to me its like this..you're going to encounter chill spots/legals in your life..why not paint them?but its the illegal spots that make you a faster/more effective writer..revok is a perfect example..im sure he rocks those wild spots in a speedy amount of time..he bombs..hard..then he goes to do a legal and its just that much better...i bet he finishes a legal wall very fast...i think bombing really helps your technique.
very on point...very... not the point at hand... but on point none the less.
i dont hate people that have done some legal walls, but if the majority of your career has been legal i dont think you are in the same calibre as an illegal writer, and your pieces shouldn't be regarded as equal.
For me as a young kid graffiti was first about getting your name up, bombing bombing and bombing, trying to get noticed by people who you looked up to. You learn the most when your out; speed, can control how to work police and generally being 'safe'. This to me is a foundation of a writer, if you never bombed and got up then I have not got a lot of respect for you.
Nowadays, I still bomb, I think it is engraved in my soul I cant stop even after several court apperences. Painting trains is the thing that drives me the most, the thrill of penatrating a yard full of purring commuter trains.
I paint 'legal' walls too, but I find when these graff events come along it seems that alot of these 'legal eagle' boys are the ones who have the biggest egos on them! Its a fucking joke!
There are deffinetly different cultures within the whole writing community, you people that paint 'safe' spots all your lifes will never fully understand this.
just dont try to come up while painting on freights! paint all the walls you want. i hate walls personally, well, not completely, but id rather be next to a freight rockin some styles. keep shit off trains... THE SLUMZ
WHATS WORSE????? STATE YOUR OPINION -
03-05-2002, 03:41 AM
